Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

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fiaj
Tiny Terror
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:22 am

Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by fiaj » Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:01 pm

Hello!
I hope this isn't considered some kind of betrayal, but I'm looking int the Night Train.
I need a really small amp, at around 15w (no less), to do gigging over the next few months (and because I jus t want one!). I have no transport to move my Orange monsters at the moment so I'm doing a more simple guitar/drum duet.
I played a Tiny Terror for the first time last month, absolutely amazing little amp! but I didn't find it versatile enough for my needs. the OR15 looks like perfection to me, the FX loop is a big plus, but it's out of my price range..
I hear good things about Night Trains and there's definitely a lot more options for tone shaping, but I can't find anywhere close enough to try one and I need a little amp pretty sharpish.
I wouldn't usually buy an amp without playing it first, but I'm prepared to risk wanting to sell it if it seems low risk. Second hand Terrors are easy to find on ebay, so I know I could sell the Vox and pick one up if we didn't get along and it seems like they're the only two suitable within the price range (under £350).

I've read a lot of TT vs NT threads and the general consensus is 70-80% of people say NT wins for versatility and tone, then the 20-30% of people say TT wins because the tone is darker etc (which is something I loved about it).
I just want to know if anyone here has enough experience with both to tell me their opinions, without being biased towards either. Most people here are probably Orange purists. I kind of am, I want a little Orange… but the one I want is just a bit too much money and these things seem to sound cool. again, there's only so much you can tell from amp demos. I want to hear real opinions.
I play a lot of different styles. from jazz to dub to death metal to ambience to doom to middle eastern music and loads in between. I think I know already that the TT wins for low volume doom but how does the NT compare when the switch is set to thick? I have some thick fuzz for doom anyway so it's not too important, but that's another thing.
how does each amp handle pedals?

Thanks in advance for any help or advice you can give.

nlimbaugh
Orange Master
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Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2011 3:13 am

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by nlimbaugh » Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:46 pm

Without even thinking about sound and regardless of reviews, the night train and the egnator seem as if they will fall by the wayside while the TT will stand the test of time. FWIW, the TT does cover more ground than it is given credit for IMO.

JRogero
Orange Hero
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Location: Portland, OR USA

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by JRogero » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:10 pm

Based on my limited exposure the Night train is pretty good but sounds a little generic compared to the TT. The thing I love about Oranges is the tone seems to have life all to its own. Even people who think Oranges are "to dark" wouldn't say the tone is boring. I just saw a recent video of the Alabama Shakes singer/guitarists playing through a pair of tiny terrors on SNL. Her guitar tone sounded great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keDbUJPWWHQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Les Paul Lover
Duke of Orange
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Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by Les Paul Lover » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:35 pm

I think the TT can do more tonaly than the Night Train.

To be fair, I think they both are pretty cool amps. I didn't think one had a particular tone control advantage over the other.

If anything, I thought that TT can do from vintage to modern, whereas the night train struggles a bit more for modern.

I don't own either, just trying them in shops. Let's not kid ourselves, they both are low wattage amp designed for nice overdrive sounds. Cleans aren't their forte. The TT can sound a little heavier by itself.

Neither or massively polyvalent amps. I believe you have a RV (100?), if so the TT wil sound closer than the NT dirt wise.
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, PPC212
And.... Genz Benz Black Pearl 30
Past Orange: AD30TC Combo, TT, AD5


Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

Thinline_slim
Orange Master
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Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by Thinline_slim » Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:47 am

Be prepared for a very biased opinion.

The first time I plugged in to a TT I was blown away. That was the start of the Orange path for me. But I started looking at Oranges because I really got into the Vox AC30 sound and I was exploring UK amps. I was pretty excited when the NT came out due to how much the TT blew me away but I've never been thrilled with the NT. Every time I've plugged into an NT I always walked away with a "meh" kind of feeling.

Yup, thuroughly biased.
Jake
OrangePaul wrote:Ok gitar lead to you Jake :D
"One of the 400"

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fiaj
Tiny Terror
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:22 am

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by fiaj » Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:13 pm

Thanks all!
Thinline_slim wrote:Be prepared for a very biased opinion.

The first time I plugged in to a TT I was blown away. That was the start of the Orange path for me. But I started looking at Oranges because I really got into the Vox AC30 sound and I was exploring UK amps. I was pretty excited when the NT came out due to how much the TT blew me away but I've never been thrilled with the NT. Every time I've plugged into an NT I always walked away with a "meh" kind of feeling.

Yup, thuroughly biased.
I just meant unbiased to the extent of no just saying the TT is better because it's the amp the person owns. A lot of people say their amp is hands down better than other amps without taking into account the different strengths of other models etc. Sounds like you're not biased in that way, just a big fan with a solid opinion.

I think you're probably all right, and I've felt like I'm probably closer to the 20-30% who would prefer the Tiny Terror for the "darker" tone. The Vox definitely doesn't please my ears as much in demos, but most of them have it running through a little VOX NT cab… and we all know Orange cabs sound WAY fatter than most anything else. I also realised that the "thick" switch on the NTs completely bypasses the EQ, so maybe not quite as versatile as I had thought.
I'd love to try a night train, but I think i've seen/heard/read enough to see it might be a risky purchase. I already know I absolutely love the Tiny Terror I spent a couple of hours with it last month and, while it may not be as flexible as I would want, the tone is outstanding and the amp is definitely capable of more than you'd think.

I doubt this will find much love here, but this is an EP I recorded with the Tiny Terror in January. Though I'm abusing a Fuzz Factory for the most part, so it's far from pure TT tone. Still sounded great through that amp, and loud enough to compete with a very loud drummer in 7w mode (I meant to switch to 15… to used to flicking downwards from standby!).

https://soundcloud.com/kianbits/sets/visitation" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There's one on ebay for £220. At that price, I think I've found my new amp… now I just need someone insane enough to trade an Orange 2x12 for my Framus cab… or I need to buy some 13ply birch and make an angled 2x12 with the V30s in the Framus. The framus cab is nice, but doesn't have the depth that Orange amps deserve!

fiaj
Tiny Terror
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:22 am

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by fiaj » Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:16 pm

Any suggestions for replacement tubes? I haven't even revalved my Rockerverb yet due to lack of money. But it wouldn't cost so much to revalve a TT. any suggestions and the strengths/differences between tubes would be greatly appreciated. I haven't tried many.

guilleonline
Orange Hero
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Location: Miami

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by guilleonline » Sun Feb 24, 2013 11:50 pm

Im not sure how soon do you need this or what is your budget but Engl jus released to the public a small lunchbox amp called the ironball. I know it sounds a bit odd, and seems like every other manufacturer swears that their amps can cover every imaginable style of music, which is all crap, but this little fella surely sounds like so.

I found a vid from namm13 where the guy test driving it really nails SRV tones and the some jazzy passages, and darker rock tones. I was very impressed, specially from a company associated with heavier metal sounds.

Anyways, just my two cents here. There is no price set yet or a day for you to pick it up at a store, gut it surely sounds fantastic.

Besides that amp, I would really say that the more styles of music you play, and you have named quite a few actually, the less of an 'ideal' amp you'll be able to find. Have you considered running two lunch boxes with a pedal two split your guitar signal? I love my Oranges, but I wouldn't recommend it for pure cleans or jazzy tones really. But again, that's just a matter of opinion.
There is nothing like a fender clean, but there is nothing like an orange crunch

fiaj
Tiny Terror
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:22 am

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by fiaj » Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:07 am

guilleonline wrote:Im not sure how soon do you need this or what is your budget but Engl jus released to the public a small lunchbox amp called the ironball. I know it sounds a bit odd, and seems like every other manufacturer swears that their amps can cover every imaginable style of music, which is all crap, but this little fella surely sounds like so.

I found a vid from namm13 where the guy test driving it really nails SRV tones and the some jazzy passages, and darker rock tones. I was very impressed, specially from a company associated with heavier metal sounds.

Anyways, just my two cents here. There is no price set yet or a day for you to pick it up at a store, gut it surely sounds fantastic.

Besides that amp, I would really say that the more styles of music you play, and you have named quite a few actually, the less of an 'ideal' amp you'll be able to find. Have you considered running two lunch boxes with a pedal two split your guitar signal? I love my Oranges, but I wouldn't recommend it for pure cleans or jazzy tones really. But again, that's just a matter of opinion.
Thanks for the input. Those Engls do seem pretty cool, but I already bought a second hand Tiny Terror. I love it too much. and yes, ideally I would twin the Terror with something else like a Darky or the Root version for the more death metal gain, or something less Orange.
In the project for which I will mostly be using the mini amp, I am running through a EHX stereo looper, so it would be great to have an amp for each output. lots of fun panning the loops around. and even looper aside it would be much greater versatility, but I can barely even afford one little amp right now. I'm spending money from my house deposit because I need a small amp FAST.
Like you say, the more styles you play, the harder it is to find the ideal amp. I'm very close with the Rockerverb, the cleans on that amp are beautiful and I can get some lovely soft jazz tones with my Gibson. I haven't had any troubles getting the tones I want yet. The clean channel is a little cold at low volumes (which I like, crystally chimes!) on the 100, but the lower gain settings on the dirty channel get all the warm, almost cleans that I want.
Having such a versatile amp does make it even harder switching to something like a Tiny Terror, eventually I'll get it a friend for some bi-amp fun!

Woodsie
Orange Expert
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Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by Woodsie » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:12 pm

I might have to grab one of those by the Ironballs. Those look awesome.
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CarbonToe.
Tiny Terror
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Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:09 pm

Re: Tiny Terror vs Night Train, unbiased advice please.

Post by CarbonToe. » Tue Feb 26, 2013 4:03 pm

I have a OR15, a TT (hardwired) and a Night Train and I love them all.

If you already have a TT I'd save my money and pick up a OR15, I love that amp. Warm vintage fuzzyness!!

The Night Train IMO is more gainy than the TT but isn't so vintage fuzzy. I use mine mainly for the Bright "channel" as this allows more tone shaping with the Treb/Mid/Bass knobs. It's well built and in the dark you can see the tubes glow!!!

The NT is a different sounding amp to the TT. Not chalk and cheese but different voicing.

I think you should buy one from a website that has a good returns policy, try it. I don't think you'll be returning it but if you do its only the postage costs at worse.

I use all the above amps with a PPC12 and do not gig.
Gear: Kurt Cobain Jaguar, Kurt Cobain Mustang, American Std Tele ('10 3burst), Gibson Les Paul Std ('97 Honeyburst), Orange OR15, Orange Tiny Terror HW, Vox Night Train NT15H, Marshall JCM-1H, PPC112 Cab & a Marshall Custom Pin-Up

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