AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

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SexingtonVonHercules
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AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by SexingtonVonHercules » Wed Aug 29, 2018 8:06 pm

This is what's happening.

All preamp and power amp tubes light up, the jewel lamp lights, but the rectifier tube does not. There's no idling noise that's normally always present once the rec tube kicks in.
The current rectifier tube is a Sovtek 5AR4. All power tubes are less six months old, and preamp tubes are a mix but all tested and functioning properly.

I pulled the rec tube and tried it in my DRRI which also uses a 5AR4/GZ34 and it lit up and I played the amp for 10 minutes which rules out a blown rec tube.

I haven't checked fuses yet but always assumed if you have a blown fuse, nothing gets power.

I've tried different cables into different cabs as well. I never use standby and don't touch the switch, and when I powered down last session, I didn't notice anything unusual.

Its a 2006 AD30HTC into a PPC412 at 16ohm

One other thing worth noting, about a year ago, I put in a "Fender full wave" GZ34, and it immediately blew the HT fuse.

Anyone have any ideas what it could be?

Les Paul Lover
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Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by Les Paul Lover » Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:37 pm

The rectifier heater circuit gets it's power from a different tap from the transformer as it works at 5.3v from memory, whereas the ecc83 and el84 heater circuit works at 6.3v.

You can find a full schematic on the Orange amp field guide website.

At this stage, it's worth considering if you could rectify (amazing pun) the issue if you could diagnose it. If you can't do the work yourself, you might as well bring it to a tech right away.

To find out what the issue is, you would need to have the amp running, and measure voltages with the amp live, which is extremely dangerous, as there are voltages up to 330v in there from memory.

I would check if the power transformer supplies the necessary power for the rectifier heater circuit.

If it doesn't, your power transformer might need replacing.

If it does..... why doesn't it get to the rectifier valve? Where does that circuit continuity fail and why?

Again, that amp is more than capable of killing you once opened up and powered, so be very careful. The electrolytic capacitors can store up to 450v for days if not weeks once switched off too.....
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, AD5, PPC212
Past Orange: Orange AD30TC Combo, Tiny Terror

Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

Les Paul Lover
Duke of Orange
Posts: 6617
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:08 am
Location: Derby, England

Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by Les Paul Lover » Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:41 pm

Oh, and the schematics will show you where the fuses are. I can't remember if there are any on the PCB.

If there are, there might be a separate one for the rectifier.... I know there isn't on for the rectifier on my AD15.
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, AD5, PPC212
Past Orange: Orange AD30TC Combo, Tiny Terror

Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

fiveightandten
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Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by fiveightandten » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:54 pm

As Ant mentioned, you need to open the chassis up and measure voltages to see what the problem is. I you don't have experience working on an energized amp, this is best left to a tech.

If you do, you'll easily find the PT secondary rectifier leads over in the corner of the main board. You'll have to check there first to see if the PT secondary is supplying voltage to it. Then check for proper connection from the blade connectors, then check that the solder joints on the socket are ok.

-Nick
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'71 GRO100 || '96 OR-80 || AD30 || '64 AC-50 || AC-30TBX || Hiwatt DR504 || HI-TONE HT30
LP Standard || LP Studio || LP Custom Lite || Ric 620 || Ric 360 || MIA Tele || SG 61 RI

bclaire
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Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by bclaire » Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:26 am

I would bring it to a tech myself.

SexingtonVonHercules
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Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by SexingtonVonHercules » Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:57 am

Update: :)

My friend gave me a new Ruby 5AR4 today. I tried it tonight and it worked right away and I played it for about an hour with no issues. I still feel I'm not in the clear yet and am still left with a lot of questions.
The most confusing thing is why the Sovtek doesn't light up in my AD30 but does in my DRRI. And why the Fender GZ34 blew a fuse on startup in the AD30. I thought all rec tubes with the same value were interchangeable.

BTW Thanks for the replies!

SexingtonVonHercules
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Posts: 13
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Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by SexingtonVonHercules » Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:09 am

One other thing, I often use a cranked ZVEX Super Hard On into channel one with gain set high and master set quite low. Is there any chance this could be hard on the PT/rec tube?. But since my master is set to bedroom level, isnt it V1 taking the brunt of it and acting as a limiter so no harsh signal gets to the power amp (which would in turn work the rectifier?)

Side note, I absolutely love how the AD30 preamp handles gain pedals. The more you throw at it, it develops this thick overloading fuzz tone that is really quite unique.

fiveightandten
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Re: AD30HTC Rectifier/PT issue.

Post by fiveightandten » Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:14 am

SexingtonVonHercules wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:57 am
Update: :)

My friend gave me a new Ruby 5AR4 today. I tried it tonight and it worked right away and I played it for about an hour with no issues. I still feel I'm not in the clear yet and am still left with a lot of questions.
The most confusing thing is why the Sovtek doesn't light up in my AD30 but does in my DRRI. And why the Fender GZ34 blew a fuse on startup in the AD30. I thought all rec tubes with the same value were interchangeable.

BTW Thanks for the replies!
Double check that your voltage switch is set to the correct input voltage for your region. But to answer your question, if the PT secondary isn't putting out the correct heater voltage, some tubes will light while others will not. This could also potentially cause the fuse to blow. Though, that could also just be an issue with that Fender GZ34.
SexingtonVonHercules wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:09 am
One other thing, I often use a cranked ZVEX Super Hard On into channel one with gain set high and master set quite low. Is there any chance this could be hard on the PT/rec tube?. But since my master is set to bedroom level, isnt it V1 taking the brunt of it and acting as a limiter so no harsh signal gets to the power amp (which would in turn work the rectifier?)

Side note, I absolutely love how the AD30 preamp handles gain pedals. The more you throw at it, it develops this thick overloading fuzz tone that is really quite unique.
That's correct. The amp is not working hard with the master volume set very low (bedroom level). Though, it sounds like you're slightly off base with the function of the rectifier.

The amp receives AC (alternating current) from the wall outlet. However, tubes run off DC (direct current). The rectifier changes AC into DC, it's as simple as that. Though, all the tubes in the amp (pre-amp and power) run off the voltage supplied by the rectifier. Not just the power tubes. It's true that when the master is high, the rectifier will be working harder. But it's supplying DC voltage for the entire amp whenever the amp is on.

-Nick
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'71 GRO100 || '96 OR-80 || AD30 || '64 AC-50 || AC-30TBX || Hiwatt DR504 || HI-TONE HT30
LP Standard || LP Studio || LP Custom Lite || Ric 620 || Ric 360 || MIA Tele || SG 61 RI

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