wattage question about my ad 50?

[kars0747]

I don´t know a lot about this. BUT. If my ad50 custom shop runs at 30 watt setting. Can I then add a 2x12 cab with 2 vintage 30´s (60 plus 60 watt) and a 1x12 cab with a g12h 30w 70th anniversary speaker. Will the g12h be able to handle it when as a single speaker it produces 30 watt ? What if I switch to the 50 watt setting. Will I blow up the 30 watt speaker in the 1x12 cab. PS the 1x12 cab I run 8 ohms and the 2x12 I run 16 ohms if that matters.

[Jondog]

All together with the two cabs, you'll have 90 watts, so yes, more than safe. Your speaker(s) wattage is the sum of all of them added up. I wouldn't run the G12h by itself even at the 30 watt setting.

[mr_william]

just to clarify a little more, the speaker doesn't "produce" 30 watts; it's power handling is 30 watts.

the way to work out speaker handling for multiple speaker cabs is the number of speakers multiplied by the power handling of the lowest rated speaker in the cab.

if you're running 2 vintage 30's, they handle 60 watts. multiply that by two speakers in the cab; the cab would have a power handling of 120 watts.

if you had a vintage 30 and the g12h in a cab, the lowest handling would be 30 watts. multiplied by two; the cab would have a 60 watt power handling.


coming onto ohmage; the options for orange amps are:

1 16 ohm cab plugged into the 16 ohm output.
1 8 ohm cab plugged into the 8 ohm output.
2 16 ohm cab's plugged into the two 8 ohm outputs. *you could also daisy chain the cabs, however, still using one of the 8 ohm outputs.

you couldn't use the 1x12 and the 2x12 at the same time.

as jondog said above, the 3 speakers would have a power handling of 90 watts (lowest handling*number of speakers = 90watts) but you couldn't use both cabs at the same time...

[Jondog]

just to clarify a little more, the speaker doesn't "produce" 30 watts; it's power handling is 30 watts.

the way to work out speaker handling for multiple speaker cabs is the number of speakers multiplied by the power handling of the lowest rated speaker in the cab.

if you're running 2 vintage 30's, they handle 60 watts. multiply that by two speakers in the cab; the cab would have a power handling of 120 watts.

if you had a vintage 30 and the g12h in a cab, the lowest handling would be 30 watts. multiplied by two; the cab would have a 60 watt power handling.


coming onto ohmage; the options for orange amps are:

1 16 ohm cab plugged into the 16 ohm output.
1 8 ohm cab plugged into the 8 ohm output.
2 16 ohm cab's plugged into the two 8 ohm outputs. *you could also daisy chain the cabs, however, still using one of the 8 ohm outputs.

you couldn't use the 1x12 and the 2x12 at the same time.

as jondog said above, the 3 speakers would have a power handling of 90 watts (lowest handling*number of speakers = 90watts) but you couldn't use both cabs at the same time...

Yeah, I answered that on his other topic about not using them together. I left out the multiply by the lowest wattage part

[kars0747]

Sorry if I´m a bit slow here guys but I´m still in the dark here. Are you saying that there is no way for me to use my 1x12 homemade cab (30watt, 8ohm speaker) togethter with my 2x12 orange cab which runs 16 ohms ? Please spell it out for me. I understand I cannot daisy chain them but can I still 1) go out from the 16 ohm exit on the back of my amp to the 16 ohm cab and at the same time 2) Have another speaker cable go from the 8 ohm exit on the back of my amp to my extension cab ?

[a.hun]

Sorry if I´m a bit slow here guys but I´m still in the dark here. Are you saying that there is no way for me to use my 1x12 homemade cab (30watt, 8ohm speaker) togethter with my 2x12 orange cab which runs 16 ohms ? Please spell it out for me. I understand I cannot daisy chain them but can I still 1) go out from the 16 ohm exit on the back of my amp to the 16 ohm cab and at the same time 2) Have another speaker cable go from the 8 ohm exit on the back of my amp to my extension cab ?

Absolutely don't do that!

You should NEVER use the different impedance outputs of an amp at the same time!!! They are basically parts of the same output transformer coil, and the 8 ohms output is just a partial tap of the full 16 ohm winding. Since part of the coil is common to both you may well overload and burn out that section. Just don't do it!)

Valve amps (unlike solid state amps) are designed to be correctly impedance MATCHED with their speaker load. That is why the impedance is labelled on the outputs. You can only correctly match multiple cabinets if they are the same impedance as each other and the combination will total an impedance the amp can safely handle. Modern Orange amps can handle either 8 or 16 ohm (total) loads. If you want to correctly match two cabs with your amp they should BOTH be 16 ohms to give a total load of 8 ohms.

If you run an 8 and a 16 ohm cab together the total impedance will be 5.33 ohms. Running that from the amps 8 ohms output is a moderate (-33%) low direction mismatch which probably won't hurt the amp, but certainly will cause faster power valve wear. It will also change the tone some and lose some amp output power - all mismatches will do both these things. High direction mismatches are more likely to cause actual serious amp damage BTW. Going too far that way can blow the output transformer.

Again though, valve amps are designed for impedance matching, so it is best not to mismatch. You can do it but it is entirely at your own risk.

BTW because they are different impedances the cabs will also draw different proportions of the amp's power. In this case the 8 ohm 1x12 will take 2/3 of the amps power, the 16 ohm cab only getting the remaining 1/3.


Andy.

[kars0747]

Thank you very much. Now I think I got it ! Thanks for your patience

[mr_william]

Sorry if I´m a bit slow here guys but I´m still in the dark here. Are you saying that there is no way for me to use my 1x12 homemade cab (30watt, 8ohm speaker) togethter with my 2x12 orange cab which runs 16 ohms ? Please spell it out for me.

coming onto ohmage; the options for orange amps are:

1 16 ohm cab plugged into the 16 ohm output.
1 8 ohm cab plugged into the 8 ohm output.
2 16 ohm cab's plugged into the two 8 ohm outputs. *you could also daisy chain the cabs, however, still using one of the 8 ohm outputs.

you couldn't use the 1x12 and the 2x12 at the same time.

[Jondog]

You'll need to get a 16ohm speaker for your homemade cab, then you can run them together and it will be an 8 ohm load on the amp. Then you'll use your 8 ohm outputs. Don't feel bad, it's a common question on the forum. By the frequency it pops up, I often wonder how many people out there have their cabs hooked up wrong.

[bclaire]

You'll need to get a 16ohm speaker for your homemade cab, then you can run them together and it will be an 8 ohm load on the amp. Then you'll use your 8 ohm outputs. Don't feel bad, it's a common question on the forum. By the frequency it pops up, I often wonder how many people out there have their cabs hooked up wrong.

By the frequency it pops up, I wonder why we even bother to have a sticky....

[kars0747]

So one absolute final ? If i get a 16 ohm speaker 30 watt for my home made cab. Dó i then use one 8 ohm exit for my home made 1x12 30 watt and the other 8 ohm exit for my 2x12 v30 cab ? And those three speakers Will then be 90 watt all together ?

[Bensnake]

So one absolute final ? If i get a 16 ohm speaker 30 watt for my home made cab. Dó i then use one 8 ohm exit for my home made 1x12 30 watt and the other 8 ohm exit for my 2x12 v30 cab ? And those three speakers Will then be 90 watt all together ?

YES! The total power handling will be 90 watts, which means you don't risk to "burn" your 30W speaker with your amp.

[a.hun]

So one absolute final ? If i get a 16 ohm speaker 30 watt for my home made cab. Dó i then use one 8 ohm exit for my home made 1x12 30 watt and the other 8 ohm exit for my 2x12 v30 cab ? And those three speakers Will then be 90 watt all together ?

NO!!!

As mr_william said already the total power handling would be 60W.

You can't just total the speakers ratings. You have to take the LOWEST power rating and multiply it by the number of speakers (cabs) you are using. That is 30W x 2 = 60.

Think about it. If each cab is taking an equal share of the amps power (with same impedances they will be) than your total rating can only be that high. If you put 90W through both cabs and they each take half of that than the 30W 1x12 would be getting 45W which is well over its rating...


Andy.

[Bensnake]

So one absolute final ? If i get a 16 ohm speaker 30 watt for my home made cab. Dó i then use one 8 ohm exit for my home made 1x12 30 watt and the other 8 ohm exit for my 2x12 v30 cab ? And those three speakers Will then be 90 watt all together ?

NO!!!

As mr_william said already the total power handling would be 60W.

You can't just total the speakers ratings. You have to take the LOWEST power rating and multiply it by the number of speakers (cabs) you are using. That is 30W x 2 = 60.

Think about it. If each cab is taking an equal share of the amps power (with same impedances they will be) than your total rating can only be that high. If you put 90W through both cabs and they each take half of that than the 30W 1x12 would be getting 45W which is well over its rating...


Andy.

So it's the number of cabs and not the speakers that counts? That should not be a problem anyway if the total power handling is 60W and the amp leaves 50W, or did I get it wrong?

[a.hun]

So it's the number of cabs and not the speakers that counts? That should not be a problem anyway if the total power handling is 60W and the amp leaves 50W, or did I get it wrong?

That's right. Basically the amp would 'see' two separate 16 ohm loads linked in parallel for a total of 8 ohms. It'll not 'see' or 'care' how many speakers make up each particular bit of the load.

Exactly the same situation if you put several same impedance but different power handling speakers into a single cab. If you bunged say 1 x 15W Celestion blue and 3 x 100W drivers into a 4 x 12 cab, the total rating would still only be 15 x 4 = 60W.


Andy.