low tuning

spade13 · Post by **spade13** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:36 pm

hay i use an orange rockerverb 50 head and 2x12 cab, i was wondering if ay of you have ideas on how to improve the responce when using low tunings (drop b ) the low b seems to be almost clean when played even thought im useing full gain? any ideas on whats going on are welcome.

just for the record this amp is used by jim root of stone sour so i now it can be used for these tunings, thanks for all sugestions given.

Meole · Post by **Meole** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 2:43 pm

You need a speaker that can handle those lows.

spade13 · Post by **spade13** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:40 pm

ahh so say a 14 inch speaker insead of the 12?

chrismathewsjr · Post by **chrismathewsjr** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 6:41 pm

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by spade13
 ahh so say a 14 inch speaker insead of the 12?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hard to find a 14" speaker, but you might enjoy a 15" + 2x12"

Andy H. · Post by **Andy H.** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 12:22 am

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Meole
 You need a speaker that can handle those lows.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Agreed. And there are 12"ers which'll do that. (Forget 14" speakers - never come across any. Some good 15"ers about of course, but they won't fit in your cab...

What speakers / FX is your Jim Root fella using? (Sorry, I don't know the band.) You wanting high gain sounds or just some healthy crunch? If you can live with traditional '70s type rock sounds but want a bigger bottom end then I'd go for the 'Heritage Series' Celestion G12H-30 which is the bass version of the classic 'H'. (Even the standard 'H' has a bit deeper bass than the V.30 in fact. Though a 'Greenback' variant it is a much more articulate and full range driver than the 25w G12M 'Greenback'.)

Another good choice if after an even more articulate and more modern sound would be their Classic Lead CL80. That has nice bass, clear mids and a nice bright top end. Great if you want all the distortion to come from the amp.

In the Eminence range, well you can read the (pdf) tone guide as well as I can...
http://www.eminence.com/pdf/tone_guide.pdf.

Just had a thought though. Getting enough bass is never usually a problem with Orange cabs. Check your cab isn't wired out of phase:
http://forum.orangeamps.com/viewtopic.php?t=18558

Andy.

chrismathewsjr · Post by **chrismathewsjr** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 2:37 am

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Andy H.
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Meole
 You need a speaker that can handle those lows.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Agreed. And there are 12"ers which'll do that. (Forget 14" speakers - never come across any. Some good 15"ers about of course, but they won't fit in your cab...

What speakers / FX is your Jim Root fella using? (Sorry, I don't know the band.) You wanting high gain sounds or just some healthy crunch? If you can live with traditional '70s type rock sounds but want a bigger bottom end then I'd go for the 'Heritage Series' Celestion G12H-30 which is the bass version of the classic 'H'. (Even the standard 'H' has a bit deeper bass than the V.30 in fact. Though a 'Greenback' variant it is a much more articulate and full range driver than the 25w G12M 'Greenback'.)

Another good choice if after an even more articulate and more modern sound would be their Classic Lead CL80. That has nice bass, clear mids and a nice bright top end. Great if you want all the distortion to come from the amp.

In the Eminence range, well you can read the (pdf) tone guide as well as I can...
http://www.eminence.com/pdf/tone_guide.pdf.

Just had a thought though. Getting enough bass is never usually a problem with Orange cabs. Check your cab isn't wired out of phase:
http://forum.orangeamps.com/viewtopic.php?t=18558

Andy.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I think someone should bring up the point that the mix of the guitar + bass guitar has a lot of impact on guitar tone. Just getting dirt on the low notes and letting the bass take care of the ultra lows is great and usually how people mix in the studios/live for a full band.

When I was younger I used to be annoyed that I couldn't get "enough bass" while I was playing alone, trying to make up for the lack of a bass guitar. I grew up to realize that it's the mix of every member that is important.

Andy H. · Post by **Andy H.** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:34 am

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by chrismathewsjr
 I think someone should bring up the point that the mix of the guitar + bass guitar has a lot of impact on guitar tone. Just getting dirt on the low notes and letting the bass take care of the ultra lows is great and usually how people mix in the studios/live for a full band.

When I was younger I used to be annoyed that I couldn't get "enough bass" while I was playing alone, trying to make up for the lack of a bass guitar. I grew up to realize that it's the mix of every member that is important.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Good point. We went into that on this thread:
http://forum.orangeamps.com/viewtopic.p ... +isolation

But I guess for some guitar styles, like the low tunings we're talking about here, the mix has to be a bit different. I can understand spade13 wanting to have his low B notes coming through strongly.

Don't know why I didn't add this Celestion to the list in the first place: G12K-100
That may well be perfect for the job...

Do check the wiring is in phase first though spade13. Be a shame to swap speakers due to a simple wiring fault!

Andy.

PopnFresh · Post by **PopnFresh** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:24 pm

If you can find them, the Ashdown Fallen Angel cabs were designed to handle baratone guitars, I think there now called Hayden Peacemaker cabs.

I can attest to there bass response, I have the Fallen Angel halfstack, and its flipping bassy!

chrismathewsjr · Post by **chrismathewsjr** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:48 pm

There was some good wisdom dispensed in that thread, thanks Andy.

There are a few little things the original poster might try as wellm but it's also a balancing acts.

Higher guage strings can aid his problem or even raising the pickups to be a little closer to the strings as a way of boosting the output.

There are disadvantages to both, though.

spade13 · Post by **spade13** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:53 am

thanx for all your sugestions guys the wiering has been checked and is fine, but thank you for sugesting it as i would never have thought to look, use size 12 strings for my drop b so im happy to say thats not the problem, i shall most definatly look in to those csellion speakers as i belive they were used by the band mentioned befor and may be fitted to ther new orange cabs,

once again thank you all for sharing your knowledge, orange amps rock

Meole · Post by **Meole** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 10:52 pm

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Andy H.
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Meole
 You need a speaker that can handle those lows.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">If you can live with traditional '70s type rock sounds but want a bigger bottom end then I'd go for the 'Heritage Series' Celestion G12H-30 which is the bass version of the classic 'H'.
Andy.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The G12H-30 "Heritage" are expensive but will give you the lows you need.
I have some I use a lot, especially if I play the 7string when people want to drop tune their guitars.

I like staying in standard tuning so a 7string works for me. Without the Heritage speakers the lows just don't sound good out of anything else.

the_blue_bomber · Post by **the_blue_bomber** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 12:00 am

I have the perfect solution when it comes to low tunings. Get a bass player.

mr_william · Post by **mr_william** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 11:07 pm

haha.. i know i shouldnt "diss" new members.. but he didnt seem like the brightest of chaps did he?..

ive gotta get me some of them there csellion speekers.. cos jim root uses em!...

low tuning

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