Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

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CitizenPsychonaut0
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Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by CitizenPsychonaut0 » Thu May 23, 2019 2:40 pm

Hi All,

I'm pondering a new purchase and figured this forum to be the best place to research. I'm currently running a Dark Terror through a PPC412 and have been quite happy with it, but am wondering what difference in sound quality that might I expect compared to the Rockerverb MkIII 100w. I'd be making use of the attenuator and fuzz pedals to dial in a tone for Doom in B or C standard tuning, typically. As a kid I briefly owned a Laney 50w and half-stack, and I remember it having a deep, almost thunderous tone/quality/attack that you could feel throughout your body as well as through the ears (even at bedroom volumes). Maybe it's the hearing loss, or false memories or whatever, but somehow the Dark Terror (as awesome as it is) doesn't quite shake the floor the way I remember. So, I'm wondering if the extra wattage from the Rockerverb would let me recapture that feeling and sound quality, or if all those watts and dollars would only result in higher volume potential.

Thanks in advance!

Jondog
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Jondog » Fri May 24, 2019 1:06 am

You’ve got the right cab to get the most from your Dark Terror. My short answer is the the 100 watt EL34 amp is much bigger/fuller sounding, than the 15 watt EL84 amp. Attenuate the 100 watt down to low levels, you’ll likely lose some quality. Theres a bunch of physics and voodoo going on. If you want to shake floors, you need the 100 watt. Or better yet a Thunderverb 200.
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Shawn Rock
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Shawn Rock » Fri May 24, 2019 2:06 am

Or15.
Maybe I'm biased.... But my Or15 shakes the windows and has plenty o thump. I've ran big power.... Nice but not needed and rarely used above like 3 on the master.... Not even cooking.I tried a Dt... Ok but not the same thump.

Beefeater
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Beefeater » Fri May 24, 2019 4:26 am

Did the Laney have a slant cab? Having the speakers hit you in the chest makes a difference if you are only standing a few feet away.

As an owner of a Dark Terror and OR15 I will tell you as great as they sound there is no substitute for the feeling of air being pushed from a high watt head. While I still feel these 15watt amps can hold thier own and pack a punch, I've yet to find a fuzz pedal that hasn't turned both to mush. Maybe that's where it's going wrong? Orange already has a great punchy fuzz tone.

My experience with attenuators (THD Hot Plate) is that it killed my tone the more I engaged it. However the so called "attenuator" built into my Thunderverb is just lovely.

Rockerverb mkiii sporting 2 channels, selectable outputs AND that same attenuator would be hard to pass up. I would imagine you could always run that Terror into the effects return of the Rockerverb as well for added el34 power and versatility.

stargazer747
Tiny Terror
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by stargazer747 » Fri May 24, 2019 11:21 am

The Dark Terror is a thunderous high gain little monster, appropriately named and rightly so! I love how big this amp sounds thru my Marshall 412 of Celestion Vintage 30s. Its even great thru 70th Anniversary speakers (G12H30) that are in my EVH 5150 III 212 and 112. I recently did a full re-tube on it, the stock JJs were old (its the oldest of my 5x Terrors and most frequently used for rehearsals at full volume). I hand picked the tubes from various brands I read their specs online and now the amp is even better IMO. Does it matter if the preamp tubes are the same manufacturer and model or not? I read many posts saying both yes and no, so I gave it a try. But the power tubes of course are matched pair. There appears to be some more clarity in the harmonics that I can recall from the original tubes and slightly more gain as well. All in all it proved to restore the amp's performance as the old factory installed tubes were beginning to make the amp sound a bit dull and drop a little volume. I love JJs as well and I keep a full set of spares for all my Terrors.
Preamp-
V1 = Mullard 12AX7 high gain rated
V2 = Tung-Sol 12AX7 Standard high gain rated
V3 = Sovtek 12AX7WB
FX Loop = EHX 12AT7
Power = TAD EL84-STR Premium Select Matched Duet
Heads: Orange Rocker 15 Terror, Brent Hinds Terror, Signature #4 Jim Root Terror, Dark Terror, Micro Dark Terror - Cabs: Marshall 412 Celestion Vintage 30s, EVH 5150 III 212 & 112 Celestion 70th Anniversary

Les Paul Lover
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Location: Derby, England

Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Les Paul Lover » Fri May 24, 2019 12:56 pm

CitizenPsychonaut0 wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:40 pm
Hi All,

I'm pondering a new purchase and figured this forum to be the best place to research. I'm currently running a Dark Terror through a PPC412 and have been quite happy with it, but am wondering what difference in sound quality that might I expect compared to the Rockerverb MkIII 100w. I'd be making use of the attenuator and fuzz pedals to dial in a tone for Doom in B or C standard tuning, typically. As a kid I briefly owned a Laney 50w and half-stack, and I remember it having a deep, almost thunderous tone/quality/attack that you could feel throughout your body as well as through the ears (even at bedroom volumes). Maybe it's the hearing loss, or false memories or whatever, but somehow the Dark Terror (as awesome as it is) doesn't quite shake the floor the way I remember. So, I'm wondering if the extra wattage from the Rockerverb would let me recapture that feeling and sound quality, or if all those watts and dollars would only result in higher volume potential.

Thanks in advance!

You'll need bigger transformers to achieve trousers flapping low end.
No 15 watter will do it. They can be loud and sound great, but they won't flap trousers for sure.
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, AD5, PPC212
Past Orange: Orange AD30TC Combo, Tiny Terror

Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

Shawn Rock
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Shawn Rock » Fri May 24, 2019 4:33 pm

Lol I love big power... You just can't use em anywhere realistically. Sound guys freak out and then you end up running it at low volumes so....ymmv...to go twice as loud as 15 watts tube you need 10x the power =150 watts. Where the hell can you play that at even half master? I dunno I'm pretty impressed by the or15 through any cab....a 2x12 or 4x12....trouser flappage onset.

Beefeater
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Beefeater » Sat May 25, 2019 1:40 am

Shawn Rock wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 4:33 pm
Lol I love big power... You just can't use em anywhere realistically. Sound guys freak out and then you end up running it at low volumes so....ymmv...to go twice as loud as 15 watts tube you need 10x the power =150 watts. Where the hell can you play that at even half master? I dunno I'm pretty impressed by the or15 through any cab....a 2x12 or 4x12....trouser flappage onset.
I have (& had) some pretty gnarly amps as of recently and none have made me smile as much as my OR15. Whether it's through my Friedman 212 with v30s or my Marshall 1960a with Greenbacks and G12h-30 anniversary it always feels great and sounds phenomenal! Just doesn't "thump" like a 50+ watter...

Ronnie Robinson
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Ronnie Robinson » Sat May 25, 2019 5:22 am

It's an interesting question and while I've not used either of those amps mentioned it's similar to comparing 2 amps I have the Ad30tc and the Rocker 15 terror.

The Rocker terror sounds good on its own but when you compare it to the ad30tc the ad30 has more punch...thats probably the best way I can describe it, more punch, more presence just a bigger sound even with the same cab.

It's not only a question of volume, bigger transformers, maybe differences in wiring quality within the bigger enclosure all make a difference.
Orange AD30 HTC
Orange Rocker 15 terror
Orange Tiny Terror HW,
Fender elite Start, Gibson SG 61,fender telecaster

Previously Owned - Rocker 30
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kmlabs
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by kmlabs » Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:45 pm

My gigging rig was a Dark Terror through a couple of PPC112s for years, and prior to that was the same cabs with a Rockerverb 50 Mk1 head. The Dark Terror had a smoother distortion that sounded better for what I was playing, but a few people did mention that my sound overall was 'smaller' when I went to the DkT
Kerry

Too much gain is... just about enough

adkguy07
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Location: Upstate New York

Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by adkguy07 » Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:24 pm

kmlabs wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:45 pm
My gigging rig was a Dark Terror through a couple of PPC112s for years, and prior to that was the same cabs with a Rockerverb 50 Mk1 head. The Dark Terror had a smoother distortion that sounded better for what I was playing, but a few people did mention that my sound overall was 'smaller' when I went to the DkT
How did you go about setting your e.q. for the Dark Terror to get that smoother distortion. What was the style of music you usually played?


adkguy07

kmlabs
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by kmlabs » Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:06 pm

@adkguy07

I play hard rock/metal, but not like the modern metalcore stuff... I used to set the shape to just a hair past noon, literally the left-hand side of the line on the knob in line with the right hand side of the line on the amp. EMG81 bridge pickup, and it sounded absolutely wonderful :)

Edit: this is my band, and this is a pretty accurate representation of how I sounded live, too:

https://youtu.be/ORMzvCoEzCk
Kerry

Too much gain is... just about enough

Les Paul Lover
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Location: Derby, England

Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by Les Paul Lover » Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:53 pm

kmlabs wrote:
Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:06 pm
@adkguy07

I play hard rock/metal, but not like the modern metalcore stuff... I used to set the shape to just a hair past noon, literally the left-hand side of the line on the knob in line with the right hand side of the line on the amp. EMG81 bridge pickup, and it sounded absolutely wonderful :)

Edit: this is my band, and this is a pretty accurate representation of how I sounded live, too:

https://youtu.be/ORMzvCoEzCk
It did sound great!!!!
A shame you had to move away!
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, AD5, PPC212
Past Orange: Orange AD30TC Combo, Tiny Terror

Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

groundmeat
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Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by groundmeat » Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:40 am

I remember those Laney amps from the 90's. The VH100 heads were really nice sounding. And the GH100S, which eventually became the GH100TI Tony Iommi signature head, was a fire breathing MONSTER.

It probably depends on what type of music you're wanting to play. If it's nothing but 24/7 headbanging hard rock and metal, then a Dark Terror would get you there. Many of the half-sized heads they make in that $500-$1000 range sound similar, it's mostly just a question of which one of those have the proper options you're looking for. For example, the Brent Hinds Terror sounds good, it has 3band EQ in the dirty channel, but NO EQ AT ALL in the clean, just a volume. But... it's there, and it's a 2 channel amp if you need to access a clean sound once in a while.

And that's where the Rockerverb 100 mk3 GREATLY differs. The clean tone is BEAUTIFUL. If you make use of clean tones often, this is the amp you want. Personally, just my opinion, the ONE AND ONLY clean amp that competes with the clean tone of these new Mk3 Rockerverbs are the '65 Fender Twin reissues. And then the dirty tone is the best you'll get from ANY Orange. Mine's a bit noisy when running the gain past 6, so be aware of that. But it doesn't get much dirtier past 6 anyway, just fuzzier and fizzier.

PPC412 is pretty thick cabinet loaded with V30's if memory serves me right, which is already gonna be a naturally bass heavy cabinet. I'm running my Rockerverb 100 mk3 through an angled Carvin Steve Vai Legacy 412 loaded with V30's. Ooooooh yeah, it's got lots of kick to it. Even when you switch it to 2-tubes/half-power on the rear panel and then switch the front panel to half-power too, it doesn't reduce the volume very much.

adkguy07
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Location: Upstate New York

Re: Dark Terror tone vs RV MkIII 100

Post by adkguy07 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:57 am

For those Dark Terror owners who've posted here, how do you go about establishing your own “clean” sound from it? Being a single channel amp, it is fairly easy to tweak either a clean if you only are playing clean at that moment. It’s also easy to dial just a workable gritty and nasty tone if only using that for a particular set of songs. I've been trying to get both tones (without external devices) dialed in, but it does involve making some “compromises”. That's where a RV MkIII has a huge advantage, or for that matter, any of the other Orange offerings with separate channels for both clean and dirt.


adkguy07

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