Best head for clean

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Smurfitt
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Best head for clean

Post by Smurfitt » Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:11 am

My band dont go through the PA. We just use a backline for pubs. I have a ppc212 closed back and use a boss gt10 so need quality clean to use the programmed patches. Which amp head will give me clean without breaking up on volume? I'm on a limited budget of between £300- £400 and currently watching evilbay and other sites for 2nd hand.
Any advice is appreciated.
Thanks

Les Paul Lover
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Les Paul Lover » Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:59 am

I'm not sure a 2nd Orange will do what you want.

You can probably find a R30, TH30 or tiny terror for that price.

The tiny terror has no headroom to speak of, the R30 has a very quiet clean channel without a boost, and the TH30 might break up too early.

If you want an Orange amp, you'll probably have to aim for 50w or 100w amp, and that gets pricey.
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, PPC212
And.... Genz Benz Black Pearl 30
Past Orange: AD30TC Combo, TT, AD5


Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

Les Paul Lover
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Les Paul Lover » Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:59 am

Forgot the CR120- might be exactly what you need.
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, PPC212
And.... Genz Benz Black Pearl 30
Past Orange: AD30TC Combo, TT, AD5


Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

Jondog
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Jondog » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:00 pm

CR120. Personally if I wanted strict clean for gigging I’d look for something more compact like the Seymour Duncan Power Stage 170. https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail ... r-amp-head
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Smurfitt
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Smurfitt » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:03 pm

Thanks I have a tiny terror & it does break up on clean too easily. it wouldnt be loud enough, not sure a 120 solid state would be as we are a 5 piece rock covers band but please correct me if I'm wrong on that one. I know the Rocker also breaks up easily but the TH30h doesnt seem to. Our other guitarist uses a TH30h and switches to 7w for gigs and the clean doesn't break up at all but not seen any that are in my price limit. What about the newer Dual terrors? How's the clean on them as there are some used going within my budget.

Smurfitt
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Smurfitt » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:10 pm

Thanks Jondog. will it be ok to run through my PPC212 as its only 120w? (60w per speaker). the guy in our local music store told me not to run anything above 60w. He's supposed to be an experienced music tech but that doesnt sound right to me.

Jondog wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:00 pm
CR120. Personally if I wanted strict clean for gigging I’d look for something more compact like the Seymour Duncan Power Stage 170. https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail ... r-amp-head

Jondog
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Jondog » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:01 pm

Smurfitt wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:10 pm
Thanks Jondog. will it be ok to run through my PPC212 as its only 120w? (60w per speaker). the guy in our local music store told me not to run anything above 60w. He's supposed to be an experienced music tech but that doesnt sound right to me.

Jondog wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:00 pm
CR120. Personally if I wanted strict clean for gigging I’d look for something more compact like the Seymour Duncan Power Stage 170. https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail ... r-amp-head
It can run that cab but the power of the amp would go down quite a lot I think. so in that sense, with a PPC212 might not be good for your situation. Theres other amps, but still, CR120 is great based on reviews here and other places.
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Smurfitt
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Smurfitt » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:24 pm

Jondog which amp are you saying the power would go down on the Seymour or CR120?
Thanks

Jondog
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Jondog » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:37 pm

Both. The CR120 will be at full power with an 8 ohm load.
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Smurfitt
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Smurfitt » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:42 pm

So if neither are any good after all for my requirements can anyone suggest alternatives?
Thanks in advance

Jondog
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Jondog » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:59 pm

Boy Narf can probably expand on the topic if he sees it. He’s done lots of research into this sort of thing.
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Les Paul Lover
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Les Paul Lover » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:38 pm

To be honest, if your band mate plays in 7w and stays clean....... the cr120 will be loud enough no doubt, even through your PPC212.

The TH30 hasn't got great headroom at full 30w to me, so if he's ok at 7w, you'll be fine with most anything really.

Can you get to try the CR120?
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, PPC212
And.... Genz Benz Black Pearl 30
Past Orange: AD30TC Combo, TT, AD5


Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

fiveightandten
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by fiveightandten » Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:22 pm

+1

7W running clean is quite low volume. A CR120 + 2x12 will blow his amp across the room if you wanted to. It will be more than enough power to match volumes, from what you are describing.
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Mystic38
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Mystic38 » Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:06 pm

Every amp will color the tone of your GT100, as in pretty much every case a "clean" channel means no dirt/distortion, but almost NEVER means tonally flat..
The ONLY example of an amp that i can think of that has a tonally flat clean channel is the Rocker series of amps where the clean channel not only has a flat response, but is also pretty near impossible to force pre-amp distortion without having very high levels of input...there is a single preamp stage, with no frequency shaping, vs a minimum of two stage plus frequency contour pls controls for every other amps "clean" channel.

Your other choice is an amp with an FX loop, and run the GT100 into the fx return.

No matter whether you go this route or not, be prepared to tweak your patches, or better, add a global eq to match the amp to your patches, and the rig to the room.

you may be better off with a blues deluxe, deville, or a power amp block of some description.
Smurfitt wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:11 am
My band dont go through the PA. We just use a backline for pubs. I have a ppc212 closed back and use a boss gt10 so need quality clean to use the programmed patches. Which amp head will give me clean without breaking up on volume? I'm on a limited budget of between £300- £400 and currently watching evilbay and other sites for 2nd hand.
Any advice is appreciated.
Thanks
fwiw as a a giggle on a bored afternoon, I ran a PODHD and then an Avid 11R into the R30 clean channel (R30 combo w G12H30) and was very pleasantly surprised at the quality of the Fenderesque clean tones and the Marshallesque crunch and drive tones...
Last edited by Mystic38 on Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-Ian-

Orange Rocker 30c, PPC212 & PPC112, Fender DRRI, Marshall 2266
2012 Gibson LP Standard, 2001 Gibson LP DC Standard
2009 Fender Am. Standard Strat, 1999 Fender Am. Hardtail Strat
2014 G&L Fallout

***insert great photos of gear here***

Boy_Narf
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Re: Best head for clean

Post by Boy_Narf » Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:14 pm

Fear not I'm here!

Depends on the kind of cleans you are going for. Sterile HI-FI? Warm tubey goo?

I have currently settled on a Seymour Duncan Powerstage 170 (for my small rig). It's about your price range but the problem is your cab. It will only run at 42.5 watts through that 16 ohm cab (probably not enough headroom). If you swapped out the cab or speakers for an 8 or 4 ohm final load, that would do the trick just fine (more expense though). Another option could be the 700 but you would have to be very careful with the gain. When I'm jamming at home I use my 500 watt bass stack for cleans (yes through the bass cab). I just dial up the tweeter a touch and back off the lows/low mids. Sounds damn near perfect.

Tube land, I had the best success with a Traynor IronHorse 40. It didn't have the EQ control I was after, but if you are using all pedals that won't be a problem. They are dirt cheap! I would plug the boss directly into the EL and bypass the preamp completely. There was a touch more headroom and sparkle when I did this.

If you are okay with a touch of hair and don't need anything pristine, I would say ditch the 212 live and pickup a fender combo. The 40 broke up too quick for me, but a Deville might do the trick for you (60 watts and much lighter than a Twin). They can be had for super cheap second hand. I might suggest going that route. The old music man heads sound good too. I haven't tried one but did a lot of research. The 100 watt would probably be up your alley.

In reality if you are not picky about features (or lack of them) as I am, then any tube head in the 100 watt range will get you where you need to go. Solid state I would defiantly be looking for something around 300-500 watts which is why I ended on a bass head. There are a pile of micro bass heads out there in the 500 watt range that would match the PPC212 perfectly (at 16 ohms as it would be around 125 watts). Perhaps check out GK MB500. I believe they also have a tube version (fusion) if you want a touch more warmth.

Although I'm an Orange addict I came to the conclusion after 4 years of searching that they will never provide the cleans I'm after. I would suggest saving yourself a headache and looking outside the brand. My portable rig is a Tiny Terror, and the Powerstage 170 through a stereo 212. My home rig is a Rocker 30 through a 612, and the SB500H through a TC1510. Still lots of Orange love happening in my world :)

Really you should take your gear into a shop and test it with everything they have. There is usually a full stock of Fender combos at every store.

GL!

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