1X12 Speaker for AD30 Head

[Hambone]

I recently upgraded from a Tiny Terror 12" combo and bought a 2003 single channel AD30 head. I tried a 2x12 cabinet, but it's just too much for my purposes. I'm going to be strictly recording and occasionally playing with friends. Maybe a rare gig here and there.

I bought an Egnater Tweaker 1x12 with a Celestion G12H-30 Anniversary speaker. I'm wondering if I should put in a higher wattage speaker, like a G12M-65? I'm never going to be running that AD30 at 100%, but I wonder if a creamback would improve the overall tone and performance? Or should I stick with the G12H-30?

[Ronnie Robinson]

Buy second hand then take some time to experiment to see what to us prefer.

Is certainly recommend trying out a we'll worn in V30.

[Les Paul Lover]

You can try other speakers - yours is already a very good speaker, and should be fine to use with your amp.

The other speakers will not improve your tone - it will be different, and that difference may be an improvement to you.

As Ronnie said, a nicely broken in V30 is a great speaker with the AD30 too.

[Hambone]

OK. How is the V30 different from the G12H-30? So no votes for the G12M-65?

[Jondog]

Just throwing this out there, because I like it so much. Eminence Red Fang. Does everything I was looking for by mixing different celestions, V30’s, Greenbacks, G12H. A bit more expensive, cheaper than a celestion Alnico and totally worth it as far as I’m concerned. I have mine loaded in a small cheap Jet City open back combo I’m using as a cab for the time being and it sounds great, better than I would expect in that set up.

[fiveightandten]

OK. How is the V30 different from the G12H-30? So no votes for the G12M-65?

The V30 is a lot more mid forward...lots of midrange. The G12H-30 has a more contoured sound that emphasizes lows and highs a bit in comparison. The V30 is a very tight speaker, whereas the G12H30 is a little more forgiving.

They're just different sounds. The V30 is fantastic for most types of crunch or distorted sounds. It works well with Orange amps, but some people find that it can be midrange overload when they use amps that weren't voiced with a V30 in mind. IMO, the only real downfall of the V30 is that clean tones can suffer when compared to a speaker that isn't so in your face.

The G12M-65 has a different sound yet again. That's a bit more mid forward than the G12H30, but not as aggressive as the V30. In terms of midrange, it's in-between. The low end isn't as pronounced as either of the other 2, as those have larger magnets.


Of the 3 speakers you mentioned, I'd personally view them like this:
- G12H30 - Full bodied tone with early breakup, clear highs, and a contoured sound that doesn't have a lot of midrange, but is balanced and can sound nice for cleans and overdrive alike. Low end is great for a 30W speaker.

- V30 - Lots of midrange, tight response, tight controlled low end, balanced highs, and a mid forward sound that makes overdrive sound great but can make clean tones a little boxy. Will never get lost in a mix. Very very good live setting speaker. I love them, but ideally I'd just choose something else for nice cleans when recording.

- G12M-65 - A nice balanced sound that lends itself equally to clean or crunch, slightly lacking in low end compared to the others, but with a warmer overall tone and smoother high end. Doesn't punch through with authority. Rather, it has a warm and pretty balanced sound, somewhat prominent in the mids.

[Hambone]

Thanks for the detailed response! So if you were choosing one strictly for recording which would you pick between the G12H30 and the G12M-65? I'm not really concerned with low end, so it sounds like the latter might be a little more refined?

[fiveightandten]

Thanks for the detailed response! So if you were choosing one strictly for recording which would you pick between the G12H30 and the G12M-65? I'm not really concerned with low end, so it sounds like the latter might be a little more refined?

They're different sounds, and it really comes down to personal preference. Out of those 2, I'd say the G12H30 is best if you want a clear top end and aren't concerned about midrange. If you want more warmth and more midrange, the G12M-65 is better suited to the job.

And to reiterate, the V30 is the speaker for crunchy overdrive. But if you're mostly a clean player, I'd look elsewhere.

Here's a quick crash course on speakers:

-There are 2 magnet types; ceramic and AlNiCo. Ceramic has more punch and is more aggressive, but also harsher and more brash. Note definition is arguably better with AlNiCo, which is also warmer and compresses much more. AlNiCo is not as tight or punchy as ceramic

-There are 3 general magnet "sizes". Light, Medium, and Heavy (L, M, and H).

-Light magnets have a very bright sound, with little low end and they compress easily. These are really only used in very low powered amps.

-Medium magnets have a midrange oriented sound. They're in-between L and H magnets, but since L aren't used a lot, it's more relevant to compare to H magnets. M's have a warmer tone with less low end, they are looser, compress more easily, and the top end is a bit more smooth, blurred, and warm.

-Heavy magnets have a stout low end, they're usually also tighter and more controlled. But they aren't as warm. Top end is more clear, but also more strident and can be harsher and less warm. They're generally punchier, but don't have the warm midrange character of an M magnet.

-There are different cones with different resonance frequencies...generally 75 Hz and 55 Hz. The 55 Hz "bass cone" lowers the frequency response and shifts everything down a bit...it's a different sound. For Celestions, you can can consider 75 Hz the "normal" resonance.

There are exceptions to these rules, and there are speakers that split the difference. There are some good YouTube comparisons out there. One of the best tools I've found to get acquainted with the differences without having to buy speakers is the Scumback website. They have a huge catalog of very well recorded clips of their speakers. There are basically all Celestion clones. You can pick a certain clip and listen to all the speakers. Make sure you stick with the same guitar/pickup/amp.

For instance, listen to "Dirty Stoners", always with clips labelled LP-WCR-CB-B...

You can download them and put them into ProTools, Garageband, Logic, etc. And switch back and forth at will. It's very informative and should give you an idea of what magnet type and design type you like.

M Magnet Scumbacks:
http://www.scumbackspeakers.com/newclips/m.html

[fiveightandten]

Oh, also...buy used speakers. New ones require a break in period, which will take months at the volumes you're playing at (or may never happen). There's a difference in sound once they break in. Pay less and let someone else do the work of breaking them in.

Reverb or eBay. Just know what you're buying, and make sure any seller you buy from knows how to pack a speaker properly.

[Hambone]

Thanks guys. Anybody have any experience with the Celestion Alcino Gold?

[fiveightandten]

Thanks guys. Anybody have any experience with the Celestion Alcino Gold?

AlNiCo. The magnet is an alloy of Aluminum, Nickel, and Cobalt. They're expensive to make due to that alloy.

It's a nice sounding speaker if you're looking for the AlNiCo sound with a decent amount of low end and a bit more of a weighty feel. Highs have a silky quality to them and the speaker is very warm, and detailed without being harsh. It's very balanced, and has a nice somewhat barky low mid presence to it, and of course does great cleans. AlNiCo's have a different sound from ceramic magnet speakers. If you want warmth, compression, and note detail without harshness, AlNiCo's are good to look into. If you are looking for punch, or tight response, stick with a ceramic.

If you're going to spend that kind of money it's worth looking into other AlNiCo offerings. The Scumback scumnico is a great speaker, and offered in up to 65W power handling. Avatar also has 2 models, the A25 (25W rating, too low for you) and the A50 (50W rating). There are also offerings from Eminence and Jensen. I can't vouch for those and I don't really have experience with them.

The scumnico is bit more detailed than the gold and compresses easier. The gold isn't harsh, but the scumnico is sweeter. The scumnico is less efficient, so the amp is quieter at the same power level (ver desirable to many people). I have an Avatar A25. If the A50 is similar (it should be), it's an AlNiCo with some attitude and punch to it. It has the distinct AlNiCo compression, warmth, and definition. But it has a lot of texture to it (is not super smooth) and has a lot of punch for something with an AlNiCo magnet.

They're all great speakers with different sounds to them. The gold is great. The scumnico and A50 are other AlNiCo options if you want AlNiCo tone in higher power handling.

[Hambone]

AlNiCo. The magnet is an alloy of Aluminum, Nickel, and Cobalt. They're expensive to make due to that alloy.

It's a nice sounding speaker if you're looking for the AlNiCo sound with a decent amount of low end and a bit more of a weighty feel. Highs have a silky quality to them and the speaker is very warm, and detailed without being harsh. It's very balanced, and has a nice somewhat barky low mid presence to it, and of course does great cleans. AlNiCo's have a different sound from ceramic magnet speakers. If you want warmth, compression, and note detail without harshness, AlNiCo's are good to look into. If you are looking for punch, or tight response, stick with a ceramic.

If you're going to spend that kind of money it's worth looking into other AlNiCo offerings. The Scumback scumnico is a great speaker, and offered in up to 65W power handling. Avatar also has 2 models, the A25 (25W rating, too low for you) and the A50 (50W rating). There are also offerings from Eminence and Jensen. I can't vouch for those and I don't really have experience with them.

The scumnico is bit more detailed than the gold and compresses easier. The gold isn't harsh, but the scumnico is sweeter. The scumnico is less efficient, so the amp is quieter at the same power level (ver desirable to many people). I have an Avatar A25. If the A50 is similar (it should be), it's an AlNiCo with some attitude and punch to it. It has the distinct AlNiCo compression, warmth, and definition. But it has a lot of texture to it (is not super smooth) and has a lot of punch for something with an AlNiCo magnet.

They're all great speakers with different sounds to them. The gold is great. The scumnico and A50 are other AlNiCo options if you want AlNiCo tone in higher power handling.

I see. For 25 years I've owned a 1962 Fender Concert with original Oxford speakers, and I believe those are Alcinos. That's the absolute best clean tone I've ever heard, so I'm definitely not looking for that with the Orange. I played it today with the single G12H30 and it sounds fantastic. Plugged into the low input, I had master up to maybe 3 with the Gain at about 4.5. I put a GE 12AT7 in V1, and it has a really nice, slightly dirty chime. I think I'll stick with this speaker for now.

[fiveightandten]

I see. For 25 years I've owned a 1962 Fender Concert with original Oxford speakers, and I believe those are Alcinos. That's the absolute best clean tone I've ever heard, so I'm definitely not looking for that with the Orange. I played it today with the single G12H30 and it sounds fantastic. Plugged into the low input, I had master up to maybe 3 with the Gain at about 4.5. I put a GE 12AT7 in V1, and it has a really nice, slightly dirty chime. I think I'll stick with this speaker for now.

Got it. The G12H30 is a nice sounding speaker. You can stick with that if you like it. If you want to get out an experiment, there are many great options to get different colors out of the AD30. An AlNiCo speaker definitely won't make it sound like your Fender, and they aren't just for cleans (great overdrive sound with most AlNiCo's), but will give a different tone to what the AD30 already provides.

I've used my AD30 with a lot of different speakers, so bump this up if you ever get curious.

Your AD30 has high and low inputs? It must be a single channel then. Cool amp.

[Hambone]

Got it. The G12H30 is a nice sounding speaker. You can stick with that if you like it. If you want to get out an experiment, there are many great options to get different colors out of the AD30. An AlNiCo speaker definitely won't make it sound like your Fender, and they aren't just for cleans (great overdrive sound with most AlNiCo's), but will give a different tone to what the AD30 already provides.

I've used my AD30 with a lot of different speakers, so bump this up if you ever get curious.

Your AD30 has high and low inputs? It must be a single channel then. Cool amp.

Thanks! It is a single channel. So far I really like the low channel a lot. I'll have to keep experimenting with the high. It's really hot. I'll probably grab another 1x12 with a different speaker down the road.