RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

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D|C|M|E
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by D|C|M|E » Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:20 pm

Les Paul Lover wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:16 pm
What ohms are your speakers?

I'm not convinced the wiring diagram were looking at would give you 16ohms if replicated in your cab.
Each speaker is 16 Ohms. There is a sticker on the side of the magnet indicating it.
Orange Rockerverb 100 MKIII [2017]
Orange PPC412-A [2017]
Orange PPC412 [2017]
Gibson SG Standard Silverburst [2007]
Gibson SG Standard Heritage Cherry [2016]
More than a dozen drive/Fuzz boxes.

Boy_Narf
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Boy_Narf » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:06 pm

Can someone smarter than me just tell this guy how to wire his speakers already!!! I'm on the edge of my seat hahaha.

D|C|M|E
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by D|C|M|E » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:09 pm

Boy_Narf wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:06 pm
Can someone smarter than me just tell this guy how to wire his speakers already!!! I'm on the edge of my seat hahaha.
Hahaha!

I want to be clear that I really appreciate this community's help and their dedication to the people on this forum looking for answers. I also appreciate how invested you are in particular. I'm just so sick of having duds from Orange. If the wiring in my cab is wrong then that's two $1000+ products back to back from them that I've gotten which have been poorly manufactured/refurbished and they are all my first experiences with Orange personally. Track record is not looking good.
Orange Rockerverb 100 MKIII [2017]
Orange PPC412-A [2017]
Orange PPC412 [2017]
Gibson SG Standard Silverburst [2007]
Gibson SG Standard Heritage Cherry [2016]
More than a dozen drive/Fuzz boxes.

Boy_Narf
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Boy_Narf » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:27 pm

I would rip the back of my PPC412 myself, but my office is soo jammed up I can't pull it out more than a few inches from the wall.

I might also try emailing Orange support again. They should be able to sort you out in a matter of moments with a proper wiring diagram.

I'm on my 7th Orange product, 5 of which I still own and never had a single issue, not even a worry about the gear. One of my tried and true rules is never to buy refurbished. No matter what it is I stay away exactly due to issues you noted. Never know which qualified "tech" has poked around in there.

The cab though, if you got for a good deal and it's just a wiring issue, then I think you won on that one! I think this might just be two cases of bad luck meaning... Something great is about to happen! YAY!

D|C|M|E
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by D|C|M|E » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:58 pm

Boy_Narf wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:27 pm
I would rip the back of my PPC412 myself, but my office is soo jammed up I can't pull it out more than a few inches from the wall.

I might also try emailing Orange support again. They should be able to sort you out in a matter of moments with a proper wiring diagram.

I'm on my 7th Orange product, 5 of which I still own and never had a single issue, not even a worry about the gear. One of my tried and true rules is never to buy refurbished. No matter what it is I stay away exactly due to issues you noted. Never know which qualified "tech" has poked around in there.

The cab though, if you got for a good deal and it's just a wiring issue, then I think you won on that one! I think this might just be two cases of bad luck meaning... Something great is about to happen! YAY!
Yeah, its looking like its time to email them again.

The thing is, I was basically tricked into buying a refurbished head. For the category that the MKII was listed as, no where in their documentation did it state that the category COULD indicate that it was refurbished. That was shady on the dealer's part. Trust me, if I saw the word "refurbished" I would never bought it.

The cab cost me full retail price. No deal there except I have the payments broke down into a 12 month plan. I'm still buying full price so all that considered, it really is still a case of me buying a high cost, high quality premium product but receiving one with a fundamental functionality issue. I've gotten no real bargains on all of this stuff outside of being able to finance the products at 0% from the dealer.

I do appreciate your positivity though. Its just hard to keep the faith in my position.
Orange Rockerverb 100 MKIII [2017]
Orange PPC412-A [2017]
Orange PPC412 [2017]
Gibson SG Standard Silverburst [2007]
Gibson SG Standard Heritage Cherry [2016]
More than a dozen drive/Fuzz boxes.

Rlw59
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Rlw59 » Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:09 pm

The top 2 speakers are in series. The bottom 2 speakers are in series. The 2 pairs are connected in parallel. Phase is all correct. 16 ohms total with four 16 ohm speakers.

Normal, correct, fine. One of the several ways to do series/parallel.

Boy_Narf
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Boy_Narf » Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:26 pm

Any chance you can record a demo for us? If you come from fender or mesa (anything with powerful high-end content/presence) you might find the Orange amps can be pretty dark and murky.

D|C|M|E
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by D|C|M|E » Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:55 pm

Rlw59 wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:09 pm
The top 2 speakers are in series. The bottom 2 speakers are in series. The 2 pairs are connected in parallel. Phase is all correct. 16 ohms total with four 16 ohm speakers.

Normal, correct, fine. One of the several ways to do series/parallel.
Thank you for looking. That's disconcerting. I still feel like there is a phase problem because of the lack of bass and full frequency response coming from the speakers.
Boy_Narf wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:26 pm
Any chance you can record a demo for us? If you come from fender or mesa (anything with powerful high-end content/presence) you might find the Orange amps can be pretty dark and murky.
I'm going to work on getting a recording done. I don't come from any specific brand. Even the bass feels weak from this 4x12. I just can't get the speakers to kick and pulse like I've experience with almost every other 4x12 cabinet. I've played Marshalls and Mesas and Peaveys and all sorts and they all seem to push MUCH harder than my PPC does. My cab sounds impotent compared to the last Marshall DSL I played through its companion Marshall 4x12. I'll see if I can capture the audio and represent what I'm hearing.

Its worth nothing that I've played other Orange heads through 4x12 cabs and been impressed and felt that at the very least it represented the appropriate amount frequency response that I would expect from an amplifier of its magnitude.
Orange Rockerverb 100 MKIII [2017]
Orange PPC412-A [2017]
Orange PPC412 [2017]
Gibson SG Standard Silverburst [2007]
Gibson SG Standard Heritage Cherry [2016]
More than a dozen drive/Fuzz boxes.

Les Paul Lover
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Les Paul Lover » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:43 pm

Rlw59 wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:09 pm
The top 2 speakers are in series. The bottom 2 speakers are in series. The 2 pairs are connected in parallel. Phase is all correct. 16 ohms total with four 16 ohm speakers.

Normal, correct, fine. One of the several ways to do series/parallel.

Are you absolutely sure?

I can't tell - the 4 way middle wire twists a little, I can't tell if it's right or not.
Also, couldn't the phase happen from the actual Jack wiring being inverted?

Just trying to be thorough. :?
I'm defo not an expert with this sort of things. One thing is sure..... if in doubt, that wiring is pretty easy to do again.

I'd be tempted to strip off and redo it just to see.... worst case scenario, you already have the before pic to redo it if needed.
Ant

Orange Gear: RV50 MKI, R30, AD15, PPC212
And.... Genz Benz Black Pearl 30
Past Orange: AD30TC Combo, TT, AD5


Guitars: Gibson Les Paul Standard Faded, Vigier Expert Retro 54, Gibson SG 70s Tribute, Aria Pro II RS X80, G&L ASAT Special Tribute

Jondog
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Jondog » Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:09 pm

Yes, if the jack has the wires backwards, the frequency is affected. Had this issue once, took a whike to find it, thought it was the amp.
Image

Boy_Narf
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Boy_Narf » Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:11 pm

Roger that!

Or just wire up one set of the speakers, or even one at a time and see if they are all sounding normal.

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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by bclaire » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:01 am

Image

D|C|M|E
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by D|C|M|E » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:21 am

bclaire wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:01 am
Image
Is that what I SHOULD have? Or is that what I have based on my picture?

Appreciate your response.
Orange Rockerverb 100 MKIII [2017]
Orange PPC412-A [2017]
Orange PPC412 [2017]
Gibson SG Standard Silverburst [2007]
Gibson SG Standard Heritage Cherry [2016]
More than a dozen drive/Fuzz boxes.

bclaire
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by bclaire » Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:38 am

That's how a 4X12 is wired with four 16 ohm speakers to have a total 16 ohm load...

Looking at your speaker cab, it looks like it's mis-wired to me - there's a jumper wire missing as well...

Sooner
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Re: RV50H MKII Problems (Long story)

Post by Sooner » Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:54 am

The cab looks like it's wired in series parallel to me. So no problem with impedance. Can't really tell if it's in phase or not from the photos. Need a diagram.

Edit: After a second look it appears the phase is correct too. Would help confirm if we could see exactly where the white/black wires go.
Sooner
AD1512 Serial No. 001

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