OT: Programmed Drums On An EP?

[Boy_Narf]

Hello Everyone,

We have been trying to record an EP for a few months now but keep running into conflicts. Something always comes up at the last minute forcing us to cancel. I live in a very small house and don't have the space to record, so we are planning to do it at our warehouse jam space. Only one guy has the key and security code, we can only use it after hours or on weekends, and we can't leave our gear there. So it's been weeks of arguing about scheduling my (the drummer) recording session at the warehouse. Our next plan was the 18th of Dec, but I've already had to cancel that so it's into the new year for sure.

I've been playing around with EZ drummer 2 for a few years now, and I'm quite competent at building a convincing drum performance. So my question is, what does everyone think about this? Is it okay to release an EP with fake drums? or is it still considered a travesty? More and more bands are programming their drum tracks, and I don't doubt that the majority of Top 40's music is all fake as well. I have all of the proper drum recording gear so I won't need to buy anything, but location and scheduling conflicts are delaying this big time.

What do you guys think? I can probably hash out our full EP in a few days with EZ Drummer 2 which will then allow us to get started on the rest of the parts. My other thought is to perhaps program the drums so we can get everything else done, then at a later time replace them with the real thing. Not sure if that's worth the time investment though.

Thanks,

[markjazzbassist]

great question. for me personally if i'm doing programmed drums/drum machine i want it to sound like a machine. what i mean is that i'm not trying to have "acoustic drum" samples triggered and make it sound real. i'd rather have it sound like a drum machine and not "fake it" so to speak. just embracing the machine side of it so to speak.

i'm not sure what kind of music you record though. prince uses drum machines and they sound like drum machines but it's done in a way where the rest of the music is at the forefront so you don't really notice/fixate on them.

[caldurham]

my advice would be to just work with what you have to record what you want. if you have ezdrummer, use it. it's amazing. no need to put yourself through a bunch of hassle when you have the tool to accomplish what you want at your disposal.

[Boy_Narf]

I play in an indie/garage rock band. My intention will be to make them sound as "real" as possible. But there is a part of me who still feels like it's cheating. Trying to get over that. I am terrible at tuning my drums (an hour at least for my three piece kit), so the programming is defiantly the easy way out.

I can just imagine chatting to someone down the line.

"Hey great drum performance, really like the fill at _______".
"Oh yea um thanks, they are programmed".
"SAY WHAAAAATTTT???".

I keep going back and forth. Before lunch I was gung ho about programming everything, now I'm back to live drumming is the only way.

First world problems...

[Jondog]

At the end of the day, it's a drum track. And if it sounds good, I say go for it. My only thing would be to stay away from creating fills you can't recreate in person. I've used EZ drummer and been happy with it. I actually think it sounds better than some recorded acoustic drums, the sound isn't always captured nicely if things aren't set-up right.

[CPL]

Nothing wrong with drum machines. Been using them for years. Sometimes you got to do with what you have to work with, especially when other people can be problematic. That's one thing about using electronics, less BS.

[Boy_Narf]

I have played the parts hundreds of times live, and plan to reproduce them exactly.

I'll just have to make the decision thanks guys.

[Les Paul Lover]

I have played the parts hundreds of times live, and plan to reproduce them exactly.

I'll just have to make the decision thanks guys.

I really think your initial suggestion is really good.
Do the "fake drums " bit, you can all progress with the rest of the recording.
If / when time allows, do the real drum recording..... And pick the best sounding recording, fake or live.

At the end if the day, what matters is that you'll have your recording in the bag. With or without the live drums.

[bclaire]

I have played the parts hundreds of times live, and plan to reproduce them exactly.

I'll just have to make the decision thanks guys.

Okay, that's key! If you can program the drums realistically, no one might ever know. See if you can do some velocity stuff so there are more dynamics - and does EZ Drummer have a setting for a "human feel?"

That said, yes you can release an album/ EP like that. Johnny A.'s latest album, Driven, was ALL programmed. It helps that John started out as a drummer and is extremely adept at programming - he used Addictive Drums.

[Jondog]

If it's just the drums that aren't real, your heaps ahead of Nikelback!

[Boy_Narf]

I have lots of experience with EZ drummer. I actually thought I had the second version, but I was wrong. Woops

I usually go over the midi notes with a fine tooth comb to make sure they sound realistic. Defiantly want to make sure the track has the same dynamic/feel as how I would play it. My solo project (sound cloud link in my sig) is all programmed with EZ drummer. I think I'm happy with the dynamics, as I can fool most people, but I'm not crazy the overall cohesion of the sound. I feel like the drums are sitting too far "out of the mix" if that makes sense. These are all a single track of midi though, I still need to figure out how split them up into different tracks (found a few articles so I'll be experimenting with this on my next demo). Once I do that I'll be able to enhance their sound even more with compressors/verb/eq on each individual track. The kick defiantly needs some help in the EQ department.

Oh yea, and after I discovered that I had the original version, I downloaded the EZ drummer2 demo. Honestly it sounds quite similar. There seems to be a bit more post processing on the kits however, but I could defiantly do that myself on the master drum bus. Not worth the $100 USD upgrade IMO.

[Randy Bass]

If it's just the drums that aren't real, your heaps ahead of Nikelback!

Thanks a lot Canada!

[Mystic38]

I dont see any problem.. after all, you are replacing recorded acoustic drums that you can play with what in essence is recorded acoustic drums that you have programmed.. if you want to go the whole hog, any cheap dig kit with midi out will allow you to play it in.

Adding velocity and timing humanisation to a programmed track will make it sound natural..and nobody will be any the wiser.. except us

[a.hun]

Hey, it's all your own work either way. Well programmed 'digi drums' can work fine. Just go for it!


Andy.

[JRogero]

EZDrummer is great. I've been using it for years. I highly recommend upgrading to EZDrummer 2. The vintage kit it comes with is great. In EZDrummer 2 You can mix and match drums and cymbals from different kits, add reverb, emulated tape delay, you can control the volume of each drum or cymbal individually, and you can take preset patterns and then easily customize them however you want. I also really like the Indie drum kit expansion. It is my favorite drum kit.

Sometimes I use the EQ's, transient shaping, and compression in Izotope's Alloy 2 to make EZdrummer sound even more like a live drum recording. It adds that little bit extra something that makes the drums pop. Alloy 2 is another one I recommend. I use it on everything. It is quite possibly the best VST ever invented.

Truth is unless you have a good set of mics and have a lot of experience recording drums you will probably get a better sound using drum software. 99% of the people won't know it is software. Though sometimes I must admit that I feel that certain something is missing from my drum tracks and wish I had the capacity to record drums at my house.