Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

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vitja
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Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by vitja » Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:22 am

Hi!

I tried to find something on this but no luck. if there is a topic, please, feel free to direct me there :)

So I had done a master volume mod to my OR120 and I LOVE the sound of the full gain setting!
I just wish I could get a little bit more gain. Is there a way to do this without boost pedals or dirt pedals. Maybe there is a mod I can do to my OR. Also, which tubes are best to drive a preamp a little more. Mullard? :D

I tried different fuzz and distortion pedals tho have a gain boost for classic stoner rock riff sound. I find that silicon fuzz face kind of a pedal is great for this. I have an old Vox Wah-wah Distortion pedal which is similar to SI Fuzz Face, but it compresses the sound a little to much. Any experiences with Univox Super fuzz? I'm thinking super fuzz would give me that low frequencies boost and dirt in combination with cranked OR.

If you guys are thinking that this mod is not worthy, I would say it is. I didn't notice any tonal change. I must say, I'm really satisfied with it! (and there is no damage done tho the chassis - Slave out!)
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by FleshOnGear » Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:57 am

In my experience, among the currently produced tubes, the Mullard reissues tend to have a lot of gain. The highest gain 12AX7 I have ever used was an ANOS early 60's Sylvania labeled for Baldwin organs. This tube had long grey plates that were built sideways.

Anyway, if you need very high gain tubes, it's best that you work with a reputable dealer who can tell you what they have that tests the highest. Certain brands have a reputation for high gain, but it isn't the most reliable indicator of gain.
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yossarian83
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by yossarian83 » Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:36 pm

What pickups are you using? I really like Gibsons burstbucker 3 with my OR120. Between the burstbucker a and NOS mullard valves, I get more than enough gain.

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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Jondog » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:13 pm

You may be able to tweak the circuit a bit to get more gain. But there are only 2 gain stages to work with. So it's not going to do a modern Orange high gain thing.
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Incubus » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:22 pm

I had an OTR120 and used a Boss OD-3 for exactly this. I found that pedal to be quite transparent and perfectly suited for the Orange.

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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Gladmarr » Tue Aug 04, 2015 4:19 pm

If you're looking at modding the amp, my suggestions would be:

1) DON'T

2) consider selling the OR120 to someone who will love her for the beautiful angel she is, and get a modern Orange.

2) figure out what your favorite "higher gain" amp is and maybe mod the OR120 to be a little closer to that amp in the first and second gain stages. With the caveat that you don't screw up the amp with extra holes or some horrible solder work inside.

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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by vitja » Tue Aug 04, 2015 4:28 pm

I use P-90s. I know… with humbuckers I could achieve more saturation, but I love the sound of P-90.
I really don't want a modern high gain… just a little bit of more gain. I think I could achieve this with just a different tubes.
Man, I'm totally in love with OR drive! It is sooooo…. creamy and natural sounding and fat and musical. I'm curious how does Overdive model sound. I heard that they are a little different.

And another thing is… I LOVE the clean sound of my OR. So probably, my next amp would be OR120 :lol: And a head switcher!

Last week I found a Highwatt 200 for 1000 euros! And is working great! Our bass player bought it so I was playing with it for few days now. It is great, huge sound and nice clean, but It just can't get close to my OR in terms of musicality! Clean is better on OR and so is the drive… Or has more drive. But Highwatt 200 is scary LOUD! and it has tons of headroom… The funny part is that they weight almost the same. OR is a little bit lighter, but not so much.

Ok, so is there any difference between OD and OR models, sound wise?
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Gladmarr » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:23 pm

vitja wrote:Man, I'm totally in love with OR drive! It is sooooo…. creamy and natural sounding and fat and musical. I'm curious how does Overdive model sound. I heard that they are a little different.
...
Ok, so is there any difference between OD and OR models, sound wise?
The difference is literally a dual ganged pot and two .068uF capacitors. That makes an OR120 into an OD120. Hopefully that's what was done to your OR120. If it isn't, that might be the key to making it sound better.

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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by vitja » Wed Oct 07, 2015 10:14 pm

Yeah, thats exactly what we did to her!

Ok, I found a nice fuzz to do the trick… but maybe I can find something better… It is Hartman 8va with switchable octave. Just the fuzz works good with it. It is so not predictable which thing would work best with overdriven or120. I could by tons of different fuzzes and would just guess.

Now I'm in hunt for best fuzz box!

And I can get more gain if I boost signal with clean boost… it is good 8)

If I get some money I will try different tubes as well.
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by afjungemann » Thu Oct 08, 2015 7:10 pm

If you want to push the amp a little more, I would suggest a tube screamer (or TS mini). They give it that extra punch that you might be looking for.
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Ronnie Robinson » Thu Oct 08, 2015 7:53 pm

What about using a preamp booster? Any reasons why your against it?
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by markjazzbassist » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:17 pm

http://www.geocities.ws/diytech_ct/FACknob.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

turn the FAC all the way left. you get more gain. your welcome.
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Gladmarr » Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:43 am

markjazzbassist wrote:http://www.geocities.ws/diytech_ct/FACknob.html

turn the FAC all the way left. you get more gain. your welcome.

That's kinda weird. I don't think that's really true. As you turn the FAC knob to get more bass, the amp should actually lose output efficiency because lower frequencies take more power to reproduce.

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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by a.hun » Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:05 am

Gladmarr wrote:
markjazzbassist wrote:http://www.geocities.ws/diytech_ct/FACknob.html

turn the FAC all the way left. you get more gain. your welcome.

That's kinda weird. I don't think that's really true. As you turn the FAC knob to get more bass, the amp should actually lose output efficiency because lower frequencies take more power to reproduce.
Different point. The fact that more bass eats up your headroom (to less sonic effect) is true. More mids is the most efficient way to cut through a mix because our ears are most sensitive to those frequencies.

But with the FAC fully left you'll definitely get more gain. That is effectively wide open, all other FAC settings will lose gain. What Nick says in that article is dead right...
http://www.geocities.ws/diytech_ct/FACknob.html wrote:More bass from the FAC will add more fuzz to the sound and more gain. More bass from the bass knob will bring up the mids a little with it, and give you less fuzz. The amp will also break up later, and sound a little more clear, but less growly.
Gain is not the same as actual perceived volume which depends on a lot more factors. :wink:


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Last edited by a.hun on Fri Oct 16, 2015 7:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Or120 Preamp gain - need more gain!

Post by Gladmarr » Fri Oct 16, 2015 7:07 pm

Speaking from experience, I can say the audible difference in gain is negligible at best.

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