Gibson advice needed...

[Wendigo]

A student of mine is looking at buying his first Gibson. The two options are a Les Paul studio with baked maple but a mahogany neck, or an SG with Rosewood but a maple neck. Both necks are glued on, not bolted, and both are real Gibsons, one with the usual 490r/t pups and the other with 498t and 490r. Neither have a clearcoat, binding or pickguard to save on costs. I have to say that I'm very surprised to see Gibson release guitar in this price range that seems to be pretty good quality. Here they are:

http://www.thomann.de/gb/gibson_sgj_ch.htm

http://www.thomann.de/gb/gibson_lp_stud ... _vs_tm.htm

I want to know which will sound better, in other words which would you rather sacrifice: the fretboard or the neck. The bodies are chambered (les paul). The other thing is, the SG has a 60s neck while the paul has a "50th" neck....is that the same as the 50s profile?

[Jondog]

I would assume 50th is a 50's taper neck which is thicker. Between those two guitars, I wouldn't worry as much about tone as I would feel, I'm sure their both good. I'd want comfort. For me it'd be the thicker neck. I've learned small necks cause my hands to cramp, causing fatigue. I've owned alot of guitars I got tired of playing for that reason. First thing I check on a guitar is the neck, if it feels like a slim taper when I first put my hand on it, I won't even pull it off the rack, means nothing to me. Unless of course it's an iconic guitar that I just HAVE to play. I wear X-large gloves, so it's big deal for the neck to be right to me, but comfort is what I base the choice on.

[fiveightandten]

Those guitars couldn't be more different when it comes to Gibsons. I have 2 Les Pauls and an SG and there's much more of a difference in feel than there is in tone.

The Les Paul is a more balanced guitar when it comes to weight and how it sits on your body. It's a lot thicker and has a carved top. The SG is much thinner, has a flat top on it, and due to the lighter body there's the neck dive issue that a lot of people have to get used to.

I'd suggest that he play both guitars standing up. If the Les Paul seems at all heavy to him (and it shouldn't being a new chambered guitar), that's something to take into consideration. If the SG is top heavy and he has a hard time keeping it balanced, that's also something to consider. I, personally, tend to play the SG more on the side of my hip. The Les Paul hangs more square to the front of my body. They're 2 very different feels that sit on your body different and feel quite different to play.

Also, another big difference is that the SG's with 60's necks and thinner neck joints tend to fluctuate in pitch more if you man handle the guitar. I have a '61 Reissue with a very thin neck and small neck joint. I've kind of incorporated this into my playing style, as I tend to shake the neck on any guitar when I play it. But I have hear people complain that those guitars fluctuate too much for them. The Les Pauls are a lot more solid in this respect.

All in all, it purely comes down to feel here. He will gravitate towards one or the other i'm sure. And I wouldn't worry about things like pickups or neck wood, as the overall design and feel of these 2 will make much more of a difference in which one is suited to him.

-Nick

[0000]

Honestly... all of the lower-end Gibson's sound quite similar, especially when they have same pickups, and in the ears of a beginner guitarist.

My first guitar was an SG and I loved it. Very light, fast and easy to play. I upgraded to a Les Paul which had more sustain and a fatter sound... but the SG was still more fun to play.

Anyway... I'd say whatever he things is cooler looking really. I think the white SG is pretty hot. However, the Les Paul does have some more fancy add-ons, like pearl inlays and a pickguard... but not sure if that's worth the extra price.

[OrangePaul]

At those prices I don't think you can go far wrong with either. Down to personal preference really I'd say. Almost makes me want to pick up one of those SGs

[Woodsie]

I don't know much about the SG. 24 frets? I have a LP Studio with the baked maple neck and 498/500 pups. It's a very good guitar. I couldn't be happier with it.

[philhed]

if he comes from germany i´d suggest this one



http://www.ebay.de/itm/LUXOR-Les-Paul-C ... 5481664%26" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

not a gibson but one of the best looking pauls i´ve ever seen, and the quality of the 70s luxor stuff is outstanding!

if i was in the market for a lester i wouldn´t post it here, but try to get it myself......

[bclaire]

Man, I don't know... neither of those has any appeal to me. I'd pick the LP over the SG just because it will probably be more versatile for your student in the long run but I have to agree and say it's more personal preference. I've never played that 50th profile but if it's anything like the Historic '57's neck size, I found it so fat it was unplayable for me.

I think you should send your student to the store and have him/her try them and then decide.... I have to wonder if an Epi LP would be a better choice?

[Jondog]

Off topic of Gibson, but when it comes to beginner guitars, I think the newer Squiers are the best deals around. Some of them (in the $300 range) are really good playing instruments.

[0000]

I'd personally have a $500 USA-made Gibson, than a $300 Squier. Granted, Gibson ARE over-priced, these new "SGJ" and "LPJ" models are quite affordable for a decent sounding and playing guitar.

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Gibson-SGJ- ... 2800864.gc" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Here is more info on that new SGJ.

Oh, and the 50's style neck is the slim-profile... not the super fat baseball bat style.

I don't see how the Les Paul would be any more versatile over the SG. They are both solid body guitars, two similar pickups, four volume/tone knobs and a toggle switch. If anything, I'd say the SG was more versatile because it has easier fret access to the higher frets.

[Woodsie]

The Squier Classic Vibes are great guitars. I have a CV50's Tele and it's great.

[Randy Bass]

I'd also consider a Les Paul Junior in that price range if it's available. They aren't for everybody, but they are amazing guitars for the money. Otherwise, the SG with a maple neck would probably be a little too bright for me (though more versatile). I wouldn't recommend settling just to get a proper Gibson though. There are some perfectly decent Epiphones at the higher end of the range that have more traditional features/ingredients. The Squier Tele Custom II with P-90s is an outstanding guitar for the money as well.

[a.hun]

Gibson advice needed...

I'd personally have a $500 USA-made Gibson, than a $300 Squier.

Yeah, the QC is just so much better.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... p?t=259543" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(Hint: think tongue in cheek...)

Good Gibson guitars (at any price point) are great. But IM(direct)E they are so variable (at any price point!) that Gibson is the one make above all I'd NEVER buy without trying the individual instrument beforehand.

But we've been here before on the forum and a few here don't / can't / won't accept that Gibson could ever put out duffers. (Backlash* to follow.)

My advice however remains simple...
'Play before you buy'!
(*Hard to argue with that really. Maybe we can just agree on that this time? )

Personally I wouldn't prejudge an inexpensive guitar from something like a baked maple board, or maple neck for that matter. Much more important that it plays / resonates well. The neck joint is probably the most important thing here and the simple test with glued neck Gibsons to see if the neck joint is wood to wood or wood to air internally is mentioned in post #31 of that thread:
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showpo ... stcount=31" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Check that with every glued neck Gibson you get your hands on in the shops and you'll get an idea just how common such problems are in your part of the world right now.

FWIW I own both an inexpensive US Gibson and a MIC CV Squier. They are BOTH very decent guitars!


Andy.

[Wendigo]

Thanks for the replies guys. I'm going up to play them both (my student is 8 years old and his parents are clueless about guitars). I think either will be fine for him, I was just more curious as to what opinions would be. Either way, I can't imagine an 8-year-old kid not being happy with one of them.

[nlimbaugh]

If he's 8 I'd think how it rests on him would be a top priority. I suppose needing a slim neck would be a given, but if not I'd be curious to know why.