My other guitarists Fender DeVille vs. my AD30

[mobkon]

The guitarist in my band has a 2X12 Fender DeVille which he runs a Harmony Les Paul into. He uses only the amps gain channels and his tone has such an amazing bite to it, it cuts through anything. This is a problem for me, as my AD30 even fully gained, can't compete. There's parts of songs that I need to at least be at his "cut" level. What can I do about this? EQ pedals? Just use distortion/overdrive pedals instead of the AD30s gain? The thing is, I love the tone of the AD30, I just need it to cut through more than it does.

Also, it seems he's louder than I am, and he's not getting any feedback. If I match his volume, I get feedback (the ugly kind) when Im not playing. What gives?

Trying to solve this issue. I know the AD30 is a pretty warm sounding amp, but I need the overall gain to cut through a lot more than it is, and for the feedback to stop (i'd rather not use a noise suppressor). Any suggestions?

Thanks!

[David Verb]

Instead of you trying to be louder or more cutting than the other guitarist... Why don't you ask him to turn down his volume or tone during your lead sections? It's cheaper and it will benefit your performance. If you can't be heard, then he is clearly, too loud.

This is why sound guys hate guitarists! We don't know how to turn down for the benefit of the overall mix! Contrasting amp tones also compliment the bands mix.

Edit: New strings help cut through too.

[danbond]

Our band has a similar set-up - Orange (R30) and Fender (Twin-amp).

My Fender amp (and most modern fenders) are mega bright, so they seem to cut well, but its not always a great thing to cut with tons of treble - it might sound good if he came down a little on the treble, you'll still sound completely different. Have you tried standing out front, where the audience is? If you are stood right infront of your amp, its quite possible you'll hear more of the other guy, as your sound is wooshing past your legs and his sound has opened up by the time it reaches you.

If you stand out front, and he's still louder, he's got to come down. Even lower wattage fenders are crazy loud in the frequencies that pop out in the mix.

What cab are you using? Our guitarist uses a Marshall with the G12-75s in it, which are apparently not good for Oranges, but I love it. Its brighter, deeper and wilder than the Orange.

[irish_admiral]

Agree... if you can't hear yourself on stage, either stand closer to your amp, or accept that you're running too loud. Get him to turn down the MV a bit. AD30s are bloody loud, so if you're running anywhere close to full volume, you're probably extremely loud already.

Agree with the comments above - the DeVilles are pretty rasping as amps, so they're going to cut a lot. An AD30 doesn't sound like a Fender! The two should complement each other decently, and it's then just a case of working out who plays what parts in order to make the most of it.

If you need more volume, mic up the amp. Get a monitor to go with it and you should be able to hear yourself fine...

[danbond]

if you can't hear yourself on stage, either stand closer to your amp

I think the opposite - get further from your amp. If you stand too close to the amp, all the sound is rushing past your legs (I have assumed the user is playing a 4x12 or 2x12) and your ears won't hear it. Either stand further away, or get the amp up to ear height.

If you need more volume, mic up the amp. Get a monitor to go with it and you should be able to hear yourself fine...

If you have to go down this route, you are definitely playing too loud!

[Bensen]

What the others said + an EQ pedal helps. Just boost the freq around 1.5k and you should be heard fine without turning the vol up too much. Wah doesn't hurt either.

[brianr0131]

I will mark this down as the first time in history a Deville was said to sound better dirty than an Orange. I know you mostly said louder but you kind of hinted towards better too.

Maybe there's something wrong with your AD30?

Those Fenders have terrible dirt sounds to my ears.

[Les Paul Lover]

Agree... if you can't hear yourself on stage, either stand closer to your amp, or accept that you're running too loud. Get him to turn down the MV a bit. AD30s are bloody loud, so if you're running anywhere close to full volume, you're probably extremely loud already.Agree with the comments above - the DeVilles are pretty rasping as amps, so they're going to cut a lot. An AD30 doesn't sound like a Fender! The two should complement each other decently, and it's then just a case of working out who plays what parts in order to make the most of it.

If you need more volume, mic up the amp. Get a monitor to go with it and you should be able to hear yourself fine...

So true....!!!
The last time I saw Le chat Noir, Teddy and Eileen proposed to the to crowd get closer to the stage - I think the crowd just went "wut???? we'll be effing deaf?". It was funny how people were like yeah, put a tentative foot forward, then considered their hearing and went like hell no!

Brilliant show though. How teddy can run around jump from the stage in to the crowd and keep playing was bloody briliant.


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Back to topic - your band mate is probably too loud. Or you need to reconsider which guitar parts you're both playing

[mobkon]

Thanks for all the replies! Though I do suppose I left out a couple details.

I'm talking strictly band practice. For live, we turn down and I can hear things fine through the monitors. But for practice, it's a tiny room and we have to turn up enough to compete with the drums. Im not running close to full volume on the AD30, it probably about half. Still, even if I crank it more, it just gets more bad feedback and it doesnt seem to get much louder. The tubes are new, had a setup a few months back.

Im just curious why my buddy isnt getting any feedback and his amp is at the same volume. Im playing through a 1978 Gibson SG and he's playing through a Les Paul. When Im not playing anything, it gets feedback. Yah the logical solution would be to turn down the amps, but thats not the answer Im looking for. Just curious why hes not getting feedback and I am? Both guitars have humbuckers, wax potted etc. At a little less volume my SG is fine where a couple of my other guitars get crazy feedback.

I run the AD30 through a Fender 4X12 cab with Celestions 30s in it I believe. I also have a Marshall JCM 800 4X12 with 75 watt Celestions that I might try to see what sounds better. An EQ pedal might also be a good investment...but I would primarily like to use the EQ pedal as a boost, not to adjust my overall sound (and keep it on the whole time)

[Randy Bass]

The reason that you would be getting more feedback at the same/less volume could be that your amp is distorting more in the power section (or both sections) or maybe he's standing in a better position in the room relative to his speakers (i.e. not pointing the pickups at the speakers). It could also be down to your signal chain/effects (if applicable), pickup design, or even the heights of your respective pickups relative to the strings.

[Captain Wedge]

Try having him plug in to your amp or vice versa. That way you know it's not the guitars.
Maybe he just does a really good job of muting his strings with his hand when he's not playing.

[danbond]

My tele used to feedback all the time. Changed the pickup, no problems now.

Is it a really high pitched feedback? Your pickups might be microphonic - does it happen on both pickups? Or just one?

[brianr0131]

I had a similar problem before....here's what worked.....I stood in front of the pother guys amp and he stood in front of mine. Sometimes you need a little distance between you and the amp.

[irish_admiral]

Suspect it's microphonic pickups, or a microphonic preamp tube.

Dan - I was assuming the amp was already tilted back to point at his ears, or off the ground!

Re: keeping up with the drummer, why don't you give your drummer bundles, or get him to use a solution to dampen the resonance of the kit. It's only practice - he doesn't need to hammer the volume. What he does need is to get the timing and beats right. Little bit less volume will save everyones' ears... he can cut loose live.

[jason41224]

unfortunately, my drummer only knows one volume, so i feel your pain.

i would guess pickups or a dodgy preamp tube. when a friend's band was recording with my R30, they tried a Les Paul with a super hot-Dimarzio pup, and it would feedback like crazy. then they tried my friend's Heritage LP with 57s, problm solved though i can't imagine the pickups on a 78 SG to be all that hot...

and do your guitarist a favor, tell him to stick to the clean channel on his hot rod and run a couple drive pedals in front of it. i've never met a person who can get along with the drive channel on those things.