Non-Gibson Les Pauls

[Action-Hank]

Hello guys n' gals

Lately I've been finding myself trawling ebay and the like gas-ing for a new guitar. As time goes on and my band gets more serious I'm gradually trying to replace the 'flawed' areas of my guitar collection with some better quality gear.
I've got a '94 Korean Samick made Epi Les Paul (aquired for free years ago) which is ok for bashing around at home, but is basically useless for recording/live work. I really like the feel of heavy LP style guitars, and have always rather fancied a LP Custom - however - as we all know they are crazy money.

So, I've been looking at Non Gibbo LP Custom alternatives like Orville, Burny, and after having a go on a friend's Silverburst Baritone, Agile.

Since all of these are pretty much 'order on line and take a chance' machines I was wondering if any of you have any experience with any of them??

I was amazed by the quality of the Agile my bud brought back from the States - and it wasn't even top of the line. Puts Epi's to shame!

Hope all is well out there!

Tom

[buzzbomb]

I have a Gibson LP Studio and a Agile 3100. All things considered they are pretty close in quality and playability (word?). I do honestly think that with the two examples I have the Gibson edges out the Agile slightly, though the finish on the Agile is much more involved and attractive. The Agile neck is insanely thick compared to the studio which itself is thicker than the Explorer. The Agile weighs in at 10lbs 8oz and the Studio is 8lbs 11oz. Overall the Agile was a better buy at 25% the cost leaving lots of money for pickups, etc. The Agile also came with better tuners and a better cut nut. I bought the studio as a shell with just the tuners in a bag on the side (which I quickly replaced), so I was able to put together the guitar I wanted. The comparison can go on and on so I'll stop. Agile = good value and good overall guitar.

[botch]

Japanese Tokai!

Soooo good! They play and sound like guitars twice their price.

http://www.richtonemusic.co.uk/index.ph ... page=index

[WAWBanks]

+1 for Tokai, they are awesome.
Also try Gordon Smith if you're looking for insane hand made quality at a decent price.

[Gtr_Pkr]

If you find a Hondo II from the 70's, those are a diamond in the rough also. Another brand that comes to mind is Greco. Good luck.

[a.hun]

+1 for Tokai, they are awesome.
Also try Gordon Smith if you're looking for insane hand made quality at a decent price.

Well I thought of suggesting that, but they tend to specialise in simpler players guitars and don't really do anything quite as hi spec as an LP Custom. If you can live without the real bindings and inlays though do check their 'LP alike' Graduate models out. I preferred their lighter Graduate 'Slimline' myself, and it has been rock solid for me. Best value quality guitars on the planet IMO, and always come brilliantly set up. You are also in the right country for them Action-Hank.
http://www.gordonsmithguitars.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Of course if you want the bindings...


Andy.

[Tango]

Ahhhhhhh, the bindings....

[Action-Hank]

Ahhhh yes, the bindings. . . . hey thats enough from you Tango - ya poser!

Those Gordon Smiths do look very nice, but they're still quite pricey when you get them to the spec you want, and they look like they'd be more at home next to a boutique amp in an expensive loft apartment, rather than getting spattered with my sweat and bits of my fingers at gigs!

The Japanese Tokais do look fantastic . . . so do the Burnys for that matter, but they are still nudging £800. There's a couple older Burnys / Orvilles etc on ebay, but without seeing them in the flesh it just feels like a real gamble going for a 20 year old guitar.

The Agiles are $425 (plus shipping obviously), which seems incredibly cheap for the spec.

Here's a coupe links

http://www.rondomusic.com/al3100boundblkgoldhw.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VhCgPi5 ... re=related" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Dang!

[OU818]

I have a late 2000 model Epiphone Les Paul SE and it is a fantastic guitar.
Combined with my $35 P90s it is the main guitar I use for my band Son Of Set.

This may belong in the 'Is Gear Important' thread however I really find that, if you spend some time searching, quality does not always have to come with a price tag.

[Alan]

Don't discount VAT and import tax when doing your sums on those Agiles, Hank!

[jason41224]

if you come across a Les under the brand "Heritage"-don't pass it up!!! great guitars

[Action-Hank]

if you come across a Les under the brand "Heritage"-don't pass it up!!! great guitars

Ya seen the price of them though!!!!??

[BrianGT]

I have a soft spot for Tokai's.......I own and have owned lot's of them and never had a duff.

If you buy a Jap model you can be safe ordering online or second hand because they don't usually leave the factory with any serious flaws. Maybe the odd cosmetic finish but you won't find a warped neck out there.....

I'm a big believer in buying the right guitar regardless of what it has on the headstock...if you have it in your hands and it plays and sounds great then it IS great! Buy it even if it's made in a telephone box!

[Le Chat Noir]

Agile aren't a great deal for us in Europe really anymore. Weak pound vs dollar, import tax, shipping, it all adds up. I'd say look at Japanese Tokais first, also any older Japanese stuff, the old Ibanez Les Paul copies are good too.

[Les Paul Lover]

I personaly still am to play a Les Paul copy that matches my current "cheapo" gibson les paul standard faded.

I'm based in the UK so Agile I've never been able to put my hands on.
I have tried all sorts of Epihone LP, Tokai LP, Vintage LP (the english Agile).

None of them had the quality feel of my current LP or all LP I've tried so far bar 2 damaged ones kept in shops for amp demo purposes.

Of Epiphone/Tokai/Vintage I thought the top of the line Epiphone did the best job.
Then Tokai, then Vintage, however I must say that I have only played lower end Vintage, so cannot talk for their top of the line gear which I have heard is pretty decent enough.

Bottom line is that some copies will bring you close enough tone wise, but I have yet to try a copy that feels as lively as a les paul. The way you feel the neck vibrate, that woody quality in the way they behave probably has a lot to do with their Nitro finish, which is much thinner than the thick poly finish you find on copies.

I find poly finish makes all guitar feel plastic-y and fairly "toylike" and cheap coming in after a true LP.

I haven't yet played a Gordon Smith or Edwards, both of which are highly praised.


My advice would be:

Try and buy a real LP 2nd hand. Gibson has produced a lot of very decent "worn finish" studio guitar, all mahogany, with either P90 or Burtsbucker Pro pick ups, that were selling new at £600/£700, that you could perhaps pick up for £400/£500 2nd hand.

You could reasonnably expect to find a decent studio in between £400/£700 upon condition.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Gibson-Les-Paul-S ... 2eaf7063e7" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This one is one of those Worn finish, but still new and perhaps slightly over priced:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/gibson-les-paul-s ... 335fddb602" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have tried one of those and thought the worn/faded finish made it an oustandingly lively instrument.

Another thing to consider is that buying a copy, you will most likely have to invest between £100 to £200 in upgrading pick ups and electronics.
A copy will lose value quite dramaticaly, whereas you should be able to resell a 2nd gibson for the price you paid for it (again, you can't guarantee that of a copy, except perhaps for edwards, which I'm stil to see one in real life!!!)

Hope this helps a bit.