FAST FOOD

[Randy Bass]

McDonald's has obviously perfected mind control and the only way to protect people from it is for government to take total control of the people. The term "Food Desert" was dreamed up by Academia to provide an excuse for previous failures in Social Engineering and to pave the way for more (failures). Stores open and close based on consumer demand. No amount of subsidies will change demand unless it is coupled with wholesale infringement of liberties. That's a recipe for a pile of poop sandwich .

[myboss57]

McDonald's has obviously perfected mind control and the only way to protect people from it is for government to take total control of the people. The term "Food Desert" was dreamed up by Academia to provide an excuse for previous failures in Social Engineering and to pave the way for more (failures). Stores open and close based on consumer demand. No amount of subsidies will change demand unless it is coupled with wholesale infringement of liberties. That's a recipe for a pile of poop sandwich .

I'm not saying that people do not have control over what they do/eat. I don't think I understand what "liberties" are being infringed upon by providing people easier access to better quality foods. I'm not saying that junk food should not exist (I love junk food), but I also agree (as a heavy drinker) that things like junk food, soda, booze, and cigarettes be taxed higher; this is coming from my personal opinion on the matter. I have no problem with that. I also think that drugs should be legal, but that's a convo for another day - just want you to know that I think individual liberties are important, but I also think that these liberties come with a price sometimes in a society where people have to rely on one another - thus a family eating crap and drinking a lot could end up weighing down on the health care systems/hospitals.

I agree that at the end of the day the responsibility is with the individual to make their choices, but if all they are given easy access to is booze, fatty salty snacks, and a Dollar Menu, then of course that is what they will choose most of the time.

I don't know what the actual solution is; as you said, and I agree with you here, it comes down to supply and demand. The problem is, the "crap food" is like a drug - it gives people that escape, and that good feeling rather than providing them with a real solution or health. And unfortunately it's so much easier to access than quality healthy foods.

[Borderline Productions]

There are problems that a free market will not solve and often will make worse. Access to quality food is one of them. Providing national defense is another. I think that McDonald's focuses its advertising at minorities because as a group they are less likely than other groups to have received a quality education, thus making them more vulnerable to advertising.

I also like Bill Maher's comment that the fast food industry has designed their menu to contain items that are more addictive than crack cocaine. We have high-fructose corn syrup that gives the brain a sugar rush, but fails to tell the brain that it is full, while in the liver it is metabolized to ethanol, which can lead to liver toxicity.

Finally, if the protagonist in "Super Size Me" had consumed as many calories eating for a month at restaurants that made real food from scratch, I doubt that his liver enzymes would have skyrocketed like they did. The food from McDonald's was poisoning his liver. That is not the normal effect of over-eating for only a month. Fatty liver takes years to develop, so there is something else going on here.

[Randy Bass]

I think the solution is to try to educate people so that they make better choices. That's what Morgan Spurlock was doing - he just did it to an extreme (at the expense of reality) to try to reach more people. It doesn't always work though and not everyone can be reached, so there is a point where you have to shrug your shoulders and let people kill themselves with food or drugs or whatever. Legalize everything - including cholesterol. Natural Selection will inevitably prey on those who fail to make a natural selection when choosing food .

[Le Chat Noir]

there is a point where you have to shrug your shoulders and let people kill themselves with food or drugs or whatever. Legalize everything - including cholesterol. Natural Selection will inevitably prey on those who fail to make a natural selection when choosing food .

I think in some ways, the debate is probably slightly different here in the UK right now regarding cause and effect - the reason being that we all contribute to a national health system and get treated free, rather than all having private medical insurance. In the US, I guess if someone gets cripplingly obese and need operations, support etc then ultimately they have to pay for it themselves... whereas if someone abuses their body here they get free treatment, no questions asked, paid for by everyone else.

It's all a moral grey area when you have this kind of system, it's hard to know where to draw the line... everyone pays their taxes, so everyone has access to the service, but should we make smokers pay extra for lung cancer treatment? Should alcoholics pay for their liver transplant? I guess the logical extreme might even say that if someone breaks their leg skiing, they probably knew the risks and are also partly responsible. I honestly don't know how I feel about it, it's a morally loaded question. There was a famous case a few years ago here, when the ex-footballer George Best was given a liver transplant and warned not to carry on drinking - he got the transplant, refused to give up the booze and died 3 years later.

[myboss57]

I think the solution is to try to educate people so that they make better choices. That's what Morgan Spurlock was doing - he just did it to an extreme (at the expense of reality) to try to reach more people. It doesn't always work though and not everyone can be reached, so there is a point where you have to shrug your shoulders and let people kill themselves with food or drugs or whatever. Legalize everything - including cholesterol. Natural Selection will inevitably prey on those who fail to make a natural selection when choosing food .

Hey, I'm with you (to an extent) there! There is a lot that has to do with people becoming educated on how to make the correct choices. I just think that unfortunately the cards are already against a lot of people who have to live under certain circumstances.

It's all a moral grey area when you have this kind of system, it's hard to know where to draw the line... everyone pays their taxes, so everyone has access to the service, but should we make smokers pay extra for lung cancer treatment? Should alcoholics pay for their liver transplant? I guess the logical extreme might even say that if someone breaks their leg skiing, they probably knew the risks and are also partly responsible. I honestly don't know how I feel about it, it's a morally loaded question. There was a famous case a few years ago here, when the ex-footballer George Best was given a liver transplant and warned not to carry on drinking - he got the transplant, refused to give up the booze and died 3 years later.

Wow! Yes, I think you are correct, things can become a slippery slope pretty quick and the lines do get blurred. That's unbelievable about the footballer!

[tony_clifton]

People can choose wether they go to McDonald's or the like; the moral debate in my opinion is how those companies cut down rainforests for livestock. 2 years later the ground is useless and they move on and repeat the process.

Not our problem, but our childrens'. Go world!

[Borderline Productions]

Not surprising about the footballer. Here in the US, Micky Mantle (famous baseball player) got a liver transplant and died shortly thereafter. I'm sure his name got him moved to the top of the transplant list. Somebody missed out on a life-saving liver because an alcoholic ex-baseball player got it instead.

[Borderline Productions]

Wow, unsustainable food preferences is another topic. I remember hearing what the impact of each person in China eating one more egg per week would have on the ecosystem. Unbelievable amount of resources for one egg per week.

[chinese fork tie]

If you drive through poorer areas in your cities (as is the case of some areas near where I currently live, and other places I have lived) notice what you don't see - quality supermarkets selling high quality produce and foods. Notice what you do see, as you drive along you'll pass liquor stores and dollar stores and empty or dilapitated houses - and then there will be the golden arches of the local McDonalds.
Not saying one group is more or less vulnerable to advertising, but these places are known as "food deserts", people who may not live too far from a good supermarket (mileage wise) but may not have their own transportation to get there, or have to take a bus or two to get to one - but just around the block is the corner liquor store or the local McDonalds or KFC. Which would you pick if you lived in an area like this? It's sad that these places exist, but that is the reality. My wife is a sociologist and has studied this sort of thing - it's really depressing. She also has worked as a teacher for 3 and 4 year olds and noticed that they will sometimes be sitting there mindlessly painting/coloring or building Legos and humming the McDonalds jingle.

maybe this is a west coast thing, but all our shittier neighborhoods (basically 85% of las vegas) have a mexican supermarket in them (best produce prices in town, so that's where i shop too). most of these stores have a van that will drive people home with their groceries after they shop at that store. and they're in every neighborhood in town, save green valley and summerlin (the white folks 'hood, chock full of whole foods and trader joe's). i've largely seen it as an issue of laziness and convenience. the healthy options are available, and people utilise them (the line at the register is usually a five to ten minute wait), but when someone is out working or running late getting home from a long shift, they'll gladly stop at the local lipid sludge factory and get a failure bucket to take home to their kids because it's less time consuming than making a meal.

[Randy Bass]

there is a point where you have to shrug your shoulders and let people kill themselves with food or drugs or whatever. Legalize everything - including cholesterol. Natural Selection will inevitably prey on those who fail to make a natural selection when choosing food .

I think in some ways, the debate is probably slightly different here in the UK right now regarding cause and effect - the reason being that we all contribute to a national health system and get treated free, rather than all having private medical insurance. In the US, I guess if someone gets cripplingly obese and need operations, support etc then ultimately they have to pay for it themselves... whereas if someone abuses their body here they get free treatment, no questions asked, paid for by everyone else.

It's all a moral grey area when you have this kind of system, it's hard to know where to draw the line... everyone pays their taxes, so everyone has access to the service, but should we make smokers pay extra for lung cancer treatment? Should alcoholics pay for their liver transplant? I guess the logical extreme might even say that if someone breaks their leg skiing, they probably knew the risks and are also partly responsible. I honestly don't know how I feel about it, it's a morally loaded question. There was a famous case a few years ago here, when the ex-footballer George Best was given a liver transplant and warned not to carry on drinking - he got the transplant, refused to give up the booze and died 3 years later.

That's what troubles me about that type of system. I'm uncomfortable with the idea that people's behavior must inevitably be regulated/controlled by government in a Nationalized system because it is otherwise unfair to those who are less of a burden on the system. A voluntary (opt-in) system would allow people to surrender some of their behavioral/dietary freedoms in exchange for government assistance. Those who pay their own way can still eat, drink, and smoke whatever they want.

I would at least like to see some level of accountability for those who do become dependent on entitlements. For example, if you are receiving Food Stamps/Aid from the government, then I do think it is acceptable for government to regulate what can be purchased with them. If Food Stamps were not able to be used for McDonald's or other items that are deemed to have a detrimental effect on health, people would have a choice whether to eat what the government does provide (healthy foods) or to generate income of their own to buy the junk food they desire. It would provide motivation to become self-reliant and/or it would improve dietary practices.

[myboss57]

People can choose wether they go to McDonald's or the like; the moral debate in my opinion is how those companies cut down rainforests for livestock. 2 years later the ground is useless and they move on and repeat the process.

Not our problem, but our childrens'. Go world!

YES! Could not agree more there, man! That's one of the reasons that I'm vegan.

[jason41224]

I would at least like to see some level of accountability for those who do become dependent on entitlements. For example, if you are receiving Food Stamps/Aid from the government, then I do think it is acceptable for government to regulate what can be purchased with them. If Food Stamps were not able to be used for McDonald's or other items that are deemed to have a detrimental effect on health, people would have a choice whether to eat what the government does provide (healthy foods) or to generate income of their own to buy the junk food they desire. It would provide motivation to become self-reliant and/or it would improve dietary practices.

flat out, EBT should not work at fast food places. in the same way that Medicare doesn't cover Breast Enlargement, food stamps shouldn't cover any fast food. if you want to splurge a little and bring your kids McDonalds on a rare occasion, one should use their own money.

[Randy Bass]

I think that Medicare should cover Breast Enlargement.

[flea]

I agree with Randy, I have seen way too many people at the grocery use food stamps to buy food/cigarettes or whatever and roll out into a expensive vehicle. I'm not for the government deciding what we do with our money, but when you ask the government to pay for your food, they should be able to prevent you from spending the money on non-food items. I'll also go further and add that while everyone may need a little help every now and then, after a certain amount of time on the welfare system, people that have 40-50,000 dollar vehicles should have to downgrade. That would limit the number of people abusing the system just to get free money.